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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 13:09:11 GMT
Hi guys. I think I may know the answer to this question, but I'll ask anyway :-)
I just received a custom shinobi-gatana that I've been waiting months for. I am very pleased with the blade, however the thing is I asked for an engraving on the blade...but I idiotically did not tell the forge how big I wanted the text and, more importantly, I wanted it in Japanese kanji! This is entirely my fault as I should of been more specific and it hurts a bit as I've been looking forward to owning my very own customised shinobi-gatana for years!
The question is, is there a technique known to man which can either smooth out the engraving so the text dissapears or some way to mask it? I think the answer will be no, and if it is I'll just have to learn to like it :-)
I will post pictures later if it helps.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 14:55:43 GMT
Sadly, I believe that the only way you are going to find to remove the engraving is to remove metal.
You would have to take the blade down to just below the depth of the engraving to truly remove it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 16:28:24 GMT
Thanks for the reply. I thought that would be the case. The engraving seems to indent very little on the blade but even if I wanted to remove the metal to eradicate the engraving, who or what kind of service is there to do it?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 17:26:51 GMT
Well, don't think of a service unless you just have money coming out your yin yang.
(Btw, if you posted a picture, we could help you more)
But there are a few different types of engraving, some can be removed easier then others. But since you said that the engraving DOES go down into the metal slightly, then the way you want to remove it is with sandpaper.
If you have a 2x4 laying around and some clamps, go ahead and break down your blade and the secure the blade to the wood. If not, see about setting the blade up somewhere that you'd be able to sand off the edge of the blade and not run into anything.
Then start off with... lets say 400 grit sand paper. If you could find it, some "Fine" emery cloth works well instead of 400 grit (and it lasts longer I've noticed) so first just sand the metal in one direction. Then sand it perpendicular to that direction, then alternate between these two till you can't see the engraving.
Depeding on how deep the engraving is, you might need to move to a lower grit paper, but I wouldn't recomend it. I've found that the lower grits can line up just right and scratch a big line into your blade.
After the engraving is removed, do the same with 600-800, then work your way up to 1000, then 2000. (The higher grits can be bought at Automotive stores like Auto-Zone or Pep Boys)
They even make a 3000 grit and higher paper, but I've found that with a 2000 grit, I can get close enough to a mirror polish.
The important thing to remember when doing this is to keep your paper oiled. It will make the sanding more uniform and the paper last longer.
BUT, if you don't want to go through any of that mess, I did see someone over in the "For Sale" thread who was offering to polish japanese blades for a price. Lemme find it...
Yeah, here it is:
/index.cgi?board=selling&action=display&thread=16289&page=1
Talk to the thread starter and see if this is something he could do for you. It sounds like he knows what he's doing when it comes to polishing, so doing an engraving removal shouldn't be a problem.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2010 21:27:53 GMT
I've attached a picture, hopefully you can get some idea on what I mean.
Thanks Greg for the info. I would love to try removing it myself but... probably after a lot more practice lol. Thanks a lot for that link, I will definitely look into it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2010 4:28:39 GMT
Ah, ok, that inscription is a bit deeper then I had imagined.
And since we are throwing 2 cents around, I'll give ya mine.
It did my heart good to see an english word inscribed on a katana. I know it doesn't seem as traditional as is the main stream thought, but in today's world the barriers between culture are coming down. It doesn't matter if your from strong Irish decent and you want to learn to use a katana, that's totally cool. Or when I see Lance over in china cutting with euros.
My point is that unless you can fluently read kanji and would be able to look at the characters and READ it and not just "Oh, tho's characters mean 'perseverance" I think that having the english text on the blade would hit closer to home when you looked at it instead of having the mystical traditional japanese word... see what I mean?
But hell, if you wanted to engrave a silhouette of a naked woman or Yo Sammite Sam (like on mud flaps) on the blade, that'd be cool too.
My biggest concern with the latest picture is to remove enough metal to not see the inscription might weaken the blade substantially.
In the end, if you find someone who will do it, and you'll be happy with it after it's done, then go for it. But if you can find happiness in the blade as it is, then that would be the road to travel.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2010 11:17:05 GMT
I should of zoomed out a little with my photos as I only showed one word Taking a good picture of a sword is much harder than it looks lol. I can't even get the photos to show the nice hamon line on the blade and I can't really show how shallow the engraving actually is. Anyway, here are some very average photos of the full sword Thank you fallschirmjager & Greg. The words I wanted on my sword has a deep meaning to me especially within these last 2 years. The problem is, I had a very specific image in my head on how I wanted it looking. The worst thing that could happen is if it made the blade garish/ugly to look at and that's what I was worried about. Greg, you're point about having the phrase instantly recognisable is very good! It' s probably because I have never seen English script on a traditionally made blade before, so it provokes weird reaction from me (and probably from everyone else who is going to see it lol) Fallschirmjager, I understand perfectly what you mean. Personally, I've always like the idea that a sword should incorporate some of the owner's 'soul' , if that is the right word to use. Whether that be in inscriptions, geometry of the blade or aesthetics. Don't get me wrong, I collect production swords as well and some of them are made beautifully, but I have always wanted a sword forged just for me and to encapsulate some of 'myself', if that makes sense This is just the beginning of this blades life as I stated above, I have a very specific image on what this blade will look like when all is done. The other main problem is that I asked for the sword to be battle ready i.e sharp enough to practice tamagishiri and unfortunately it has arrived blunt. Not sure how much it is now going to cost me to sharpen it. I think if there words were much smaller, I would appreciate it more. I am interested to see what you guys think
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2010 16:04:48 GMT
And when you think back to all the warriors who had inscriptions done to their blades, it was in the native language. It's only now that the language is dead or from another country that gives them a mystical quality.
But your inscription is in your native language. Now figure out the best way to put an edge on (weather it's done by you or someone else) and use it! Let your sword be symbol of your resolution. And if you should ever pass the blade on to your children, then the message will be written for them as plain as day.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2010 16:43:06 GMT
Thanks for those wise words guys. I can tell you must really love swords! I think I'm convinced that I will stick with the inscription, it's a little big but I can live with it Greg, those paragraphs you wrote really hit home! Especially the last one. I think I was too caught up in having it look 'authentic' after all these years being influenced by how a katana/shinobi-gatana should look, without actually realising that the whole point of this was to have a blade completely unique and with my own personal touch. Thanks for making me realise this. +1 Karma to all you guys that helped and offer your opinions! It's a pity I can only give a point every hour but all will be given before the day is done I think I'm going to like it here on this forum. fallschirmjager, I totally agree, my sword MUST be sharp. I don't know which route I will take to accomplish this but now I know what to aim for....I have just seen Greg's 22 bottle cut.... holy crap!! If that sword can do that, cutting tatami mats should be no problem! I have been inspired lol Now how to go about it... The journey to fully customising my blade has just begun as apart from sharpening, all the fittings are going to be changed, I need a custom tsuba made up and I also want a mirror finish. Out of interest Greg, have you used that grit paper to get a mirror finish on any of your blades? Was it very difficult? Wish me luck and I will post pictures of it's progress.
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 26, 2010 19:24:54 GMT
sidenote: what happened to fallschirmjager's posts? I must agree with Greg- as if it's hard to... well stated and poignant- I hadn't considered that until now... and I like it. and that sword looks pretty badass already.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2010 20:32:34 GMT
Thanks chrisperoni!
Yeah, what did happen to fallschirmjager's posts?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2010 22:05:12 GMT
Funny story about mirror polishes.
My first sword was my VA Longsword. I loved that thing and oiled it every night. I started doing research on how to polish it and went through the process of starting at a 400 grit and working my way yup to 2000.
With a 2000 grit, the blade becomes a fuzzy mirror. I could see if there was anything in my teeth, but I couldn't see my pores. So me being me, I took the blade out cutting, having a great time. But then I started getting obsessed with keeping the finish just perfect and I was almost afraid to cut with it (keep in mind that I would let my friends cut with it too, who used to not be able to keep from hitting the ground)
Finally I got tired of keeping up the polish and now the very same blade has a 600 grit finish.
But as far as how difficult it was, I wouldn't call it difficult, but it was time consuming. I had put about 6 hours into bringing the mirror out. And I'd do it again. The whole process was incredibly relaxing.
If you want a "bathroom" mirror finish, then 2000 MIGHT do it. but people have better success with 3000 grit for that.
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 27, 2010 2:35:16 GMT
There is a calmness that comes from working with your hands and meditative aspect to the repetition of action- I've heard this from many people and experience this myself especially when sanding and filing.
I've pretty good results with 1000 and 2000 grit, getting steel to reflect with a near perfect finish if the metal is close to the reflected object. I should state that's been with stainless steel, I haven't tried to polish my carbon blades myself (knife or sword). I will be trying this on the gladius I'm remounting.
Damn it great to work on your own design! I am jealous that you've had this sword engraved to originality (does that sentence make sense?)
Be sure to keep us posted on your work on this katana
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 27, 2010 2:37:47 GMT
-are you going to sharpen it yourself? I'm not confident enough in my sharpening abilities to do a sword- I still practice on knives for now- 'course mine came pretty darn sharp- cut myself a few times over the years
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2010 8:53:59 GMT
I actually wouldn't mind trying to polish it myself however since the forge who made it did not sharpen it like I told them to (I expressed my concern to the person who arranged my blade to be forged and he said it is sharp and it just might have more 'niku' than I am used to...Any blade that I can run my hand over it's edge without any consequence isn't sharp to me ) ,I thought it would be best to get a professional to work on the blade to get it polished to a mirror finish and to get it razor sharp.....I certainly don't trust myself to sharpen it to that level as a beginner Yes, I would love to show the progress of this blade on this forum. I wanted to ask you guys opinion: Should I post the updates under this thread or create a new one? hey chrisperoni, if you've cut yourself over the years with the blades you've sharpened, it means you're doing a great job
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 28, 2010 15:32:24 GMT
Yes, I would love to show the progress of this blade on this forum. I wanted to ask you guys opinion: Should I post the updates under this thread or create a new one? hey chrisperoni, if you've cut yourself over the years with the blades you've sharpened, it means you're doing a great job 1. Let others correct me if I'm wrong but I think the best course of action is to post the progress in /index.cgi?board=swordcustommaybe with a link to that thread in this one? 2. Just to clarify: While I will sharpen my knives myself I have not ever tried to sharpen my swords (I don;t trust myself across such a long blade not to screw something up). I was saying that they were delivered sharp and have kept their sharpness well over the years. To be fair that's also because I don't do too much cutting and spread it around between all the swords... Have you tried to cut with yours yet? Get out there and take a swing, it's the only way to know for sure if it's sharp enough for you- after reading up on safety of course: /index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=5150/index.cgi?board=cutting&action=display&thread=4307
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2010 19:24:19 GMT
Yeah, this morning was meant to be my first tameshigiri training session with some friends from the Bujinkan...suffice to say, it didn't go well! My sword truly is blunt as it couldn't cut it's way through a brown paper bag....literally lol Oh well it was good to see my friends skills. I am definitely going to employ the services of someone who knows what they are doing to polish my sword.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2010 19:36:10 GMT
Oh and yeah,I saw that horrifying picture a few months back, scared the crap out of me! Swords are certainly not toys! Even the blunt ones can cause serious injury. The first thing I did when I received my blade was to dismantle to look for anything which could lead to potential injury. Thankfully, though it is blunt, it seems to be very well made with as full tang which travels nearly the entire length of the tsuka, has some rust on the tang which helps keeps the blade in place and the tsuka itself seems to be quite strong and well constructed. I'll let the forge off for now
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2010 11:37:51 GMT
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