Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2009 11:09:26 GMT
Is DSA spatha they call "sparta" historic? Does if feel good in hand?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2009 14:11:13 GMT
I don't know much about spathas but I do know that this one is 1lb too heavy and it shouldn't have leaf blade. The hilt doesn't look very historical but I don't know much about spatha hilts. The most common design is very simplw though and looks pretty much like a normal gladius. See this one by Albion: www.albion-swords.com/swords/albion/nextgen/sword-roman-auxilia-spatha.htmBasically, if you want to see what typical sword of a certain type looks like, it might be good to go and see if Albion produces one just to see what general shape you should look for.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2009 21:58:19 GMT
I was always kind of against this sword, because, to be honest, it's a copy of a beautiful and equally functional Jody Samson original, the Centurion Spatha; which is also one of my favorite fantasy swords of all time. Additionally, the weight and lack of distal taper would keep me away from it if it were not a Jody Samson knock-off. Attachments:
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2009 22:03:39 GMT
Ah, so that's why it looks so much better than DSA's usual offerings. Hmmm.
I just think they should at least get the NAME of the sword right, good lord. It's not very historically accurate, but it certainly doesn't make it seem so when they don't spell the name of the sword-type correctly.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 1:56:14 GMT
I was always kind of against this sword, because, to be honest, it's a copy of a beautiful and equally functional Jody Samson original, the Centurion Spatha; which is also one of my favorite fantasy swords of all time. Additionally, the weight and lack of distal taper would keep me away from it if it were not a Jody Samson knock-off. That spatha looks very good. This is actually one of the few, if not the only spatha that I have seen, that looks better in my eye than DSA:s spatha. Many spathas hilt structure looks like a pepper mill and I dont like that even if its historic. Im open to temptations to buy a spatha. It is not necessary for me to own a spatha, but if I find a good looking and functional spatha with a good price I will consider buying it. DSA:s spatha looks the best I have seen yet in its price class, but if its unhistoric then it is a big problem. So leaf blade is ahistoric on spatha. What else is historically wrong with this DSA:s spatha? I like a lot its pommel and guard with sandwitched wood, but is it historic feature? Is there some other types ancient of swords that resemles this? What kind of swords were barbarian imitations of spathas?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 7:28:40 GMT
The original Samson version or the DSA copy of it probably never existed historically. The leaf blade form was an early period development that had been completely abandoned by the Romans at the time spathae were developed and used (0AD - 600AD). Leaf blades are alot closer to early gladius hispaniensis (below) than to spathas as far as the Romans go: Good luck in your search...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 8:53:41 GMT
I was always kind of against this sword, because, to be honest, it's a copy of a beautiful and equally functional Jody Samson original, the Centurion Spatha; which is also one of my favorite fantasy swords of all time. Additionally, the weight and lack of distal taper would keep me away from it if it were not a Jody Samson knock-off. Yeah, it's pretty obvious that they "borrowed" Jody's design. To this day I don't understand how they could have possibly thought people wouldn't notice. And what makes the matter even worse is that they went and based more or less all their other leaf-shaped blades on that exact design as well.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 9:46:32 GMT
Everything about DSA's and Jody's spatha is a-historic. Leaf blade, sandwiched grip, grip wrap,... just everything. For a historic spatha you have to buy an Albion or go custom. Even the new VA gladius is a-historic considering its fullers and threaded construction. No, as bad as it sounds, there is no historically accurate spatha in the sub Albion-price market.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 14:33:24 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 16:02:05 GMT
Yeah, it's pretty obvious that they "borrowed" Jody's design. To this day I don't understand how they could have possibly thought people wouldn't notice. And what makes the matter even worse is that they went and based more or less all their other leaf-shaped blades on that exact design as well. I'm guessing they thought that no one would recognize it. For my part, I've never seen Jody's version so I didn't recognize it as anything other than another DSA offering that may have historicity issues...but hey, we don't shop DSA for historical accuracy now do we?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 21:10:01 GMT
The blade seems wrong, every spatha I've ever seen had a diamond shaped blade, this one doesn't. The grip's nice though. Also, DelTins are known for their lack of distal taper so they don't really qualify for historically accurate swords.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2009 23:35:18 GMT
KoA says it has distal taper from 4.9mm-3mm. Not that bad. Roman spathas mostly had fullers but later barbarian spathas had blades both with diamond section, fullers, often multiple and simple flat blades much like this one. Often pattern welded but not always of course. It's of course hard to say if such weapons are copies of roman spatha or native germanic weapons so you could call them early migration era swords, not spathas. Here is Albion's future spatha with octagonal blade section: www.albion-swords.com/swords/albion/nextgen/sword-roman-alaris-spatha.htm
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2009 1:22:02 GMT
The blade seems wrong, every spatha I've ever seen had a diamond shaped blade, this one doesn't. The grip's nice though. Also, DelTins are known for their lack of distal taper so they don't really qualify for historically accurate swords. Not exactly. Spatha, especially post 1st century, featured a variety of blade cross-sections. The DT spatha represents a 3rd Century version so the blade shape is not necessarily inaccurate. Most Del Tin swords I've seen/handled do have some sort of Distal Taper, to some degree or another (that doesn't mean they all handle all that great, but there are other factors there....). The fact that a sword lacks distal taper does not necessarily make it "historically inaccruate", as not all swords had DT. There are examples of Roman, Migration-era, and Viking era swords that have little to no DT. Granted, swords with DT are the norm (making swords wihtout it the exception to the rule), and swords with more DT certainly handle better, but the lack of DT/little DT doesn't necessarily make a sword historically incorrect.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2009 10:24:40 GMT
I'm guessing they thought that no one would recognize it. Yeah, but they didn't even try to hide it. They even added those notches at the base of the blade, which is a feature I have never seen on any other leaf blade, ever. It's like they went out of their way to make it a knock-off. Don't get me wrong, I don't like accusing anyone of "stealing" designs, because I actually consider swords to be fairly open source. If anything I think people are too hung up on originality these days. But I don't see why anyone would even want to copy a sword down to the most distinguishing features rather then giving it a character of it's own. And I see nothing wrong with making a more affordable version of one of Samson's masterpieces, but if that's what you want to do, why try to cover it up by claiming it "combines both Roman and Germanic influences reflecting the crosscultural exchanges resulting from centuries of warfare"? I just don't get it. The blade seems wrong, every spatha I've ever seen had a diamond shaped blade, this one doesn't. ´ Oh. spathae had plenty of blade shapes other the the diamond one. These lenticular ones were relatively common, as I understand. Heck, Albion has one in the works with double fullers, and another one with a octagonal cross-section and a thrust-oriented blade. Speaking of Albion, has anyone seen the new Auxilia? That looks like one sweet sword. I mean, I don't even like spathae and I still want one. o.O
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2009 11:18:02 GMT
Also, DelTins are known for their lack of distal taper so they don't really qualify for historically accurate swords. Most Del Tin swords I've seen/handled do have some sort of Distal Taper, to some degree or another (that doesn't mean they all handle all that great, but there are other factors there....). The fact that a sword lacks distal taper does not necessarily make it "historically inaccruate", as not all swords had DT. There are examples of Roman, Migration-era, and Viking era swords that have little to no DT. Granted, swords with DT are the norm (making swords wihtout it the exception to the rule), and swords with more DT certainly handle better, but the lack of DT/little DT doesn't necessarily make a sword historically incorrect. OK I say it differently, every GOOD historic sword had distal taper. A sword without handles poorly and why would you want to replicate a bad historic sword? Of course there were less-quality swords back there just like there are today but I don't see any use in replicating a bad example of a spatha.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2009 20:59:42 GMT
Well, 5mm to 3mm really isn't that bad.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2009 18:29:35 GMT
No it's not, you're right. Then maybe THIS Del Tin could be called historically accurate but most, heck, all the Del Tins I've seen had little to no distal taper. This one's an exception then. Could still be improved though. Starting at 6mm going down to 3mm 1" behind tip would be better. It's close enough however.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 19, 2010 22:11:49 GMT
I'm interested in the DSA 1303 "spatha". I understand that it may not be historical but does anyone have it? How does it feel, cut, thrust, etc...? I can't afford the Albion and, despite the unhistoric look, I kind of like the DSA sword. Oh, the Arms of Valor sight state that the blade is 28" long while the listing on Kult of Athena states that it is only 25" long. Anyone know the truth? I don't expect a centurion to scold me for being out of uniform, I just want a sword that looks cool, durable and does its job well. Thanks. Todd
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 19, 2010 22:36:03 GMT
|
|
|
Post by sicheah on May 20, 2010 1:41:39 GMT
I'm interested in the DSA 1303 "spatha". I understand that it may not be historical but does anyone have it? How does it feel, cut, thrust, etc...? I can't afford the Albion and, despite the unhistoric look, I kind of like the DSA sword. Oh, the Arms of Valor sight state that the blade is 28" long while the listing on Kult of Athena states that it is only 25" long. Anyone know the truth? I don't expect a centurion to scold me for being out of uniform, I just want a sword that looks cool, durable and does its job well. Thanks. Todd The centurion would scratch its head and wonder who would have made that sword, it looks so different from what I know about spatha. I know that KoA measure and weigh their swords. Given such a stark difference in measurement, it could be a different sword or QC...ah what do I know . A historically accurate spatha is around 2-2.5lb in weight and has a very forward PoB. It is meant to be a slashing weapons. The DSA with a pound heavier and with PoB closer to hilt will be a very different weapon... On the other hand, there is a Hod-Hill Spatha designed for reenactment by Al-Hamdd Trading Post sold by Armamentaria. There is a review by dwilson here. Historically accurate and beautiful in fittings and handles similar to a spatha (blade heavy) and less than $300 shipped. But not sure if it cuts well since it is designed for reenactment. Even though the VA Actium is not a spatha (it is a gladius hispaniensis of Republican Period) but it has a length and feel quite similar to a spatha, though one might take issue with large pommel.
|
|