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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 5, 2021 0:40:26 GMT
Pictured: A cheaper blade with a better heat treat.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 7, 2021 20:10:39 GMT
Response I got from CAS yesterday:
CAS Iberia
Wed, Jan 6, 5:32 AM (1 day ago)
to me
Good morning,
Apologies it has taken some time to get back to you, we're usually short staffed through the holidays and last year busy at the same time...
Very sorry to hear of the break, during prototype testing we had two failures that led to some changes for production - however neither was the Yataghan model.
Would you send the yataghan to us for inspection? It's difficult to tell from the photos whether a crack was present after heat treatment (usually indicated by a dark area near the edge) or it was caused during use. Either way our preferred result of failure would have been a bent blade, not a break. I'd like to test the hardness and have a good look at the steel grain.
You can send the knife to our office here:
ATTN: APOC Warranty / Blake
CAS Iberia, INC
650 Industrial Blvd
Sale Creek, TN 37373
Thank you,
CAS Customer Service
Plus this follow up note:
Something else I should mention - Gus Trim did not design the Yataghan. That was an in-house design.
Thank you,
CAS Customer Service
So today I sent them the broken blade. I guess we'll see what comes back my way.
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Post by Eric Bergeron on Jan 7, 2021 20:54:45 GMT
That's great that they want to see the blade first hand, can't wait to see what they have to say when they get it.
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Post by randomnobody on Jan 8, 2021 0:08:57 GMT
I assume Blake is Blake Pogue, who is a member here and a solid guy who genuinely wants what's best for both customer and company.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 8, 2021 0:47:53 GMT
I assume Blake is Blake Pogue, who is a member here and a solid guy who genuinely wants what's best for both customer and company. I'm sure he's a decent Blake whether he's a Pogue or not. And I'm sure he'll figure out a way to improve production on the APOCs so we can get back to lining our bunker walls with them. And I'm sure he'll send me another yataghan and maybe that Brutus, who knows, so I can do that cutting video you all want to see. But in all seriousness whoever DID design the yataghan prototype did a good job. Guess only some of the other swords were Gus Trim.
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Post by cearball on Jan 10, 2021 23:45:42 GMT
D guard Bowie by windlass as a replacement?
I just want to see you test it TBH lol
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 12, 2021 0:18:15 GMT
D guard Bowie by windlass as a replacement? I just want to see you test it TBH lol I'm gonna have to eventually. Maybe another Windlass Qama first. That was my first functional sword, ten years ago. I broke it doing torture tests. I guess that's my thing. I remember being impressed by its chopping ability and would like to revisit it.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 12, 2021 19:28:48 GMT
And this response today:
Went through some testing with your Yataghan and some others here. At present it looks like an isolated heat treat issue on that blade. I took another Yataghan and bent it (with the help of a 3' bar) to the point it took a set at a near 45 degree angle. That is my preferred failure result on this line. The same test on the tip section of your yataghan produced another similar break leading me to think a crack or other steel flaw in that location alone is unlikely to be the problem.
Testing hardness at the tang yours was around 55 HRC averaged over 3 points (one even registered at 57) while the sample I bent measured at 45 HRC on average. The tang is typically softer than the edge so I would say the blade is definitely overly hard. In addition the grain on your example is not ideal.
I could not break the other sword I tested so I cannot compare the grain at this time. I'll take this info back to the forge for their feedback as well.
I am going to send you a replacement - USPS (tracking number)
Thank you and let me know if you have any issues with the replacement,
Blake
So the one I broke definitely did not meet specs and I'll be testing a new one for you.
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Post by randomnobody on Jan 12, 2021 19:41:42 GMT
Wow, didn't think they'd go so far in testing, but good on them. Definitely seems like yours was an anomaly, which is promising. Hopefully the next one will be better.
45 HRC is pretty low for modern blades, but for a glorified machete, it's a solid number.
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Post by vidar on Jan 12, 2021 20:45:28 GMT
Respect for Blake for good customer service!
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Post by Eric Bergeron on Jan 12, 2021 20:49:14 GMT
Amazing customer service and I think the 45 hrc was the tang and not the blade if I was reading that correctly.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 12, 2021 20:58:12 GMT
Wow, didn't think they'd go so far in testing, but good on them. Definitely seems like yours was an anomaly, which is promising. Hopefully the next one will be better. 45 HRC is pretty low for modern blades, but for a glorified machete, it's a solid number. 45 in the tang. The edge is supposed to be low 50s.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 12, 2021 21:12:09 GMT
Yeah, I'm lucky I got through to someone who is knowledgeable and involved with the product line instead of a customer service rep who can't do anything about it.
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Post by randomnobody on Jan 12, 2021 21:35:22 GMT
Wow, didn't think they'd go so far in testing, but good on them. Definitely seems like yours was an anomaly, which is promising. Hopefully the next one will be better. 45 HRC is pretty low for modern blades, but for a glorified machete, it's a solid number. 45 in the tang. The edge is supposed to be low 50s. Oh yeah, tang. I was still figuring not more than 5 HRC difference in the edge, but if it's closer to 55 HRC that should do the job.
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Post by pellius on Jan 12, 2021 21:52:55 GMT
Sounds like the best possible outcome. That’s great!
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Jan 12, 2021 22:43:04 GMT
That says much for the company.
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Post by wlewisiii on Jan 13, 2021 2:10:19 GMT
I've been pondering the APOC Broadsword. Reading this thread and especially how they've taken care of the OP's issues makes it more likely that I'll buy it.
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Post by alientude on Jan 14, 2021 0:33:54 GMT
I'm very much not a fan of the tactical look, but the customer service response you received has made me consider picking up an APOC sword as a beater.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 14, 2021 0:45:58 GMT
I'm very much not a fan of the tactical look, but the customer service response you received has made me consider picking up an APOC sword as a beater. Even if you're not much for tactical swords, if you ever go camping or do yard work with a machete, consider one of the smaller ones like the yataghan, kukri, etc., because I think they're really quite practical designs.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Jan 17, 2021 3:57:48 GMT
New Yataghan received and ready for some smiting.
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