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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2008 22:33:11 GMT
Actually, look at this, from an un editable wiki page.
The ninjatō (忍者刀, ninjatō?), also known as ninjaken (忍者剣, ninjaken?) or shinobi katana (忍刀, shinobi katana?), is the most common name for the reputed sword a ninja would have carried. According to the book Ninjutsu History and Tradition by Masaaki Hatsumi, Soke (Headmaster) of the Bujinkan Dojo system, these swords came in a variety of shapes and sizes. Often, however, they were much shorter than the traditional daito katana used by the samurai of feudal Japan.
hmm?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2008 22:43:55 GMT
Further down the page it does say that the Ninjato is a "fictional" sword but none the less is still a sufficient means of labeling a straight blade like the one master293 has shown us.
but it also says that ninja swords were actually straight with a slight curve, straight from Masaaki's book, just like Master293's sword.
bloodwraith acted completely out of hand, he could have simply said that they're called Ninja ken or something instead of acting like a pissed off house wife, WELL EXCUSE ME!
/rant
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Post by 293master293 on Aug 14, 2008 1:09:51 GMT
Thanks Seth. BTW, the last 4.5 inches of the back edge is razor sharp to. Makes it 20x more fun. Sweet! So you can also do reverse strikes? Yep.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2008 11:15:47 GMT
Let's just clear something up shall we. First of all, yes I practice traditional Ninjutsu which is why I get very annoyed when people start spreading misinformation that they picked up from dubious sources. Like most other people in this hobby and this martial art the most damaging thing that people can do is spread misinformation. Few people know about the realities of the ninja and Ninjutsu. All people seem to know these days is the BS that hollywood claims is a ninja or a ninja sword. Ninja-to basically means a sword used by a ninja, that is what irritates me, the ninja did not use one type of sword that was termed a ninja-to, infact there is no evidence that they used straight swords at all.
Also Bishop, as an academic I have to say that your so called "unchangeable" evidence is not a creditable source because anyone can write anything on wiki, there are no checks in place to make sure people are posting the right information.
Anyway I am done with arguing with ignorant people who think that just because they can read a dubious wiki page they know what they are talking about.
You're excused just don't do it again.
I don't think I acted out of hand, why would you want to willingly perpetrate misinformation? All I was trying to do was to help him realise that the term ninja-to is inaccurate. Ninja ken? Geez that is just as bad, just call it a shinken and have done with it.
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Post by swordboy bringer of chaos on Aug 14, 2008 11:46:48 GMT
blood I understand about not wanting YOUR art polluted with misinformation ....... but dude you are being an ass about it and you have crossed the no hostility line a few times I would appreciate it if you take a few steps back please ......... the KID made a FANTASY sword out of a broken blade ...... and that seems pretty ninja to me(using resources at hand)
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2008 13:43:23 GMT
God, I friggin hate ninjas.
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Post by axeman on Aug 14, 2008 14:09:28 GMT
blood I understand about not wanting YOUR art polluted with misinformation ....... but dude you are being an ass about it and you have crossed the no hostility line a few times I would appreciate it if you take a few steps back please ......... the KID made a FANTASY sword out of a broken blade ...... and that seems pretty ninja to me(using resources at hand) I DON'T SEE WHATS THE big DEAL the guy made a new sword out of parts of one old sword why cant he call it WHAT HE WANTS SOMEONE JUST NEEDS TO RELAX
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Post by oos3thoo on Aug 14, 2008 14:48:05 GMT
Wow... Everyone is ganging up on Bloodwraith. I think the correct term for Masters sword would be Tactical ninja-to or something.
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Post by brotherbanzai on Aug 14, 2008 16:46:49 GMT
Hey Master293, that's great! I'm a big fan of turning busted stuff into useful stuff.
I studied ninjutsu for a couple of years when I was younger under Larry Beaver, who was one of Steven Hayes' original students. I recall some open-minded discussions between Larry, myself, and some of the more interested students about whether or not we were even studying and actual, historical, art. We never came up with anything more definitive than 'maybe'. The important thing was that we enjoyed it and found some of it to be useful, some of it not.
I can understand Bloodwraith's bristling at misinformation about an art he studies, but given the pervasiveness of the "ninja" in popular culture you kind of have to expect it. Heck, the term 'broadsword' to describe a cruciform sword isn't historically correct either and how many of us say that?
Now to get back on topic...
Do you have any pics of the damaged sword before you re-shaped it? I'd be interested to see how much work you had to do to get a usable blade again. Also, were you able to preserve the temper while re-shaping?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2008 16:58:28 GMT
Let's just clear something up shall we. First of all, yes I practice traditional Ninjutsu which is why I get very annoyed when people start spreading misinformation that they picked up from dubious sources. Like most other people in this hobby and this martial art the most damaging thing that people can do is spread misinformation. Few people know about the realities of the ninja and Ninjutsu. All people seem to know these days is the BS that hollywood claims is a ninja or a ninja sword. Ninja-to basically means a sword used by a ninja, that is what irritates me, the ninja did not use one type of sword that was termed a ninja-to, infact there is no evidence that they used straight swords at all. Also Bishop, as an academic I have to say that your so called "unchangeable" evidence is not a creditable source because anyone can write anything on wiki, there are no checks in place to make sure people are posting the right information. Anyway I am done with arguing with ignorant people who think that just because they can read a dubious wiki page they know what they are talking about. You're excused just don't do it again. I don't think I acted out of hand, why would you want to willingly perpetrate misinformation? All I was trying to do was to help him realise that the term ninja-to is inaccurate. Ninja ken? Geez that is just as bad, just call it a shinken and have done with it. First of all, ninja ken literally means ninja sword. And even Dr. Masaaki said that ninja did use swords, usually rather straight with a slight curve and coarse grinded edge. Unless you're saying that he's not a creditable source, then wow, just wow. Just because you practice in Ninjutsu doesn't give you the right to make your word law, Ninjato is a commonly used word, I see it used by manufacturers everywhere, master isn't spreading anything but already commonly seen information. Oh and not all sources on wikipedia are editable, ignorance is bliss though.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2008 17:09:12 GMT
blood I understand about not wanting YOUR art polluted with misinformation ....... but dude you are being an ass about it and you have crossed the no hostility line a few times I would appreciate it if you take a few steps back please ......... the KID made a FANTASY sword out of a broken blade ...... and that seems pretty ninja to me(using resources at hand) this is the point, master's sword doesn't classify as anything else so why not call it a ninjato, it's not like he's breaking the sacred law of the ninja or anything, he's just naming it something he likes.
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Post by 293master293 on Aug 14, 2008 17:09:37 GMT
Do you have any pics of the damaged sword before you re-shaped it? I'd be interested to see how much work you had to do to get a usable blade again. Also, were you able to preserve the temper while re-shaping? Sorry, no before pics. I was able to keep the temper on the body of the blade simply because there is not a lot of grinding done there, though the last 4.5 inches I had to re-harden because there was a lot of grinding done there. BTW, does anyone know what steel this is? It stays extremely hard even when red-hot, drilling this thing was a semprini.
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Post by oos3thoo on Aug 14, 2008 17:17:16 GMT
Language my friend. ;D
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Post by rammstein on Aug 14, 2008 17:23:52 GMT
If I can offer a similar analogy, a lot of medievalists get pissed off at people calling their swords "broadswords" since a broadsword was a weapon of many centuries later and the proper name is arming sword or something similar.
It's a pedantic argument and annoys a lot of people - that doesn't mean it's wrong. So bloodwraith is entirely correct here. But just as correct are the people annoyed by it. I don't think either side is totally incorrect, I just think this argument is more than a little pointless. No side is going to win.
(Just for clarification, ninja's aren't these hollywood polevaulters who use magic powder and posses mystal abilities to pogo stick on their swords.)
edit:
Ha ha, beat me to it ;D
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2008 12:33:31 GMT
I can understand Bloodwraith's bristling at misinformation about an art he studies, but given the pervasiveness of the "ninja" in popular culture you kind of have to expect it. Heck, the term 'broadsword' to describe a cruciform sword isn't historically correct either and how many of us say that? I can understand it as well, but the thing is we are not popular culture. We know the proper terms, we know BETTER. The information should be common place for us in the sword world. But either way, any more discussion over the semantics of the use of broadsword or nonja toes will require I unsheath my zanbato and lay a smackdown ;D.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Aug 16, 2008 13:51:59 GMT
use of broadsword or nonja toes Yeah! Ninja Toes are an important part of the culture. Thats why they have those cute little Tabbi shoes which show of those lethal little toes.
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Post by oos3thoo on Aug 16, 2008 14:28:42 GMT
Lmao! Good one! +1 Karma buddy!
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Post by 293master293 on Aug 19, 2008 21:38:00 GMT
Second time cutting with the sword.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2008 3:33:46 GMT
As another who practices Ninjutsu I can say that the modern "hollywood" version of the ninjaken has become on of my favorite types of blades. True, ninja did not use these modern style swords, but they are effective in Ninjutsu and have become another type of ninjaken. A very good example of a modern functional ninja blade would be the blackwind katana or wakizashi. Very nice work on the sword, by the way.
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Post by 293master293 on Sept 2, 2008 3:51:42 GMT
Very nice work on the sword, by the way. Thank you.
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