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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 2:34:18 GMT
Post by cj7wheeler on Jan 31, 2015 2:34:18 GMT
I think this might be the most attractive hamon I've seen. I really like how it's got tone and texture, not just a line.
what do you think? what do you like in hamon? |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 2:56:10 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Jan 31, 2015 2:56:10 GMT
That one's not bad. Hamon are a complicated thing, but I actually like them simpler. Too many people go crazy over o-chojo or sanbonsugi or hitatsura or whatever, just give me a subtle suguha and I'm thrilled to bits. Gunome, notare, midare, whatever...suguha is where it's at. Unless we're talking Ayasuji hada. I'll take gunome there, as long as it matches the hada. Like this one that just sold on eBay: www.ebay.com/itm/221669515166?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AITOtherwise, suguha: www.aoijapan.com/img/sword/2010/10142-2.jpgAs a general rule I'm not really thrilled with hadori. I prefer sashikomi, but darn it if keisho isn't the "rule" these days.  |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 3:05:57 GMT
Post by Timo Nieminen on Jan 31, 2015 3:05:57 GMT
I like function. Which means "not too wide". Narrowish and straight is fine. Not as pretty, but I like it better since it's more functional.
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 3:15:18 GMT
Post by cj7wheeler on Jan 31, 2015 3:15:18 GMT
I can understand the functionally of a narrow and straight hamon but for a show blade, something just to look at. I want some beautiful hamon.
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 3:20:04 GMT
Post by Cottontail Customs on Jan 31, 2015 3:20:04 GMT
I'm also partial to a nice even suguha on the narrow side (see Random's example) but every once and a while I'm grabbed by something else such as this  which should be in my hands any day now. -Josh |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 3:30:59 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Jan 31, 2015 3:30:59 GMT
Remind me what that was, Josh?  |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 4:36:12 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 4:36:12 GMT
It's nice but not tournament winning worthy. Theres a lot of unattractive width variables that should have had a steadier hand and more focus to keep the aesthetics more pleasing.
Not bad, not amazing either.
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 12:59:33 GMT
Post by DigsFossils-n-Knives on Jan 31, 2015 12:59:33 GMT
That one's not bad. Hamon are a complicated thing, but I actually like them simpler. Too many people go crazy over o-chojo or sanbonsugi or hitatsura or whatever, just give me a subtle suguha and I'm thrilled to bits. Gunome, notare, midare, whatever...suguha is where it's at. Unless we're talking Ayasuji hada. I'll take gunome there, as long as it matches the hada. Like this one that just sold on eBay: www.ebay.com/itm/221669515166?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AITOtherwise, suguha: www.aoijapan.com/img/sword/2010/10142-2.jpgAs a general rule I'm not really thrilled with hadori. I prefer sashikomi, but darn it if keisho isn't the "rule" these days. :( I'm the complete opposite when it comes to hamons. It's interesting how much preferences can vary. Years ago I spoke to someone who preferred a fake wire brushed to "no hamon" on the blade. I think I had a chill running down my spine when I heard this then I realized who am I to say his preference is wrong. |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 13:04:31 GMT
Post by DigsFossils-n-Knives on Jan 31, 2015 13:04:31 GMT
I think this might be the most attractive hamon I've seen. I really like how it's got tone and texture, not just a line.
what do you think? what do you like in hamon? I think I've seen the most attractive hamons on the swords sold by Huawei and Walter Sorrels. Please let me know if there are other makers known for exquisite hamons. I'd love to see them. |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 16:02:48 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 16:02:48 GMT
I think this might be the most attractive hamon I've seen. I really like how it's got tone and texture, not just a line.
what do you think? what do you like in hamon? I think I've seen the most attractive hamons on the swords sold by Huawei and Walter Sorrels. Please let me know if there are other makers known for exquisite hamons. I'd love to see them. I think he meant the quality of the polisher, not the hamon design. |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 16:05:07 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 16:05:07 GMT
I can understand the functionally of a narrow and straight hamon but for a show blade, something just to look at. I want some beautiful hamon. Polishing a suguha hamon is the most difficult to do and earns the most admiration actually. To keep the line straight and width even is very, very difficult. |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 16:51:07 GMT
Post by Jussi Ekholm on Jan 31, 2015 16:51:07 GMT
It completely depends on the sword. I have very wide range in my aesthetics taste.  This one is pretty spectacular as a whole.  |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 17:35:14 GMT
Post by cj7wheeler on Jan 31, 2015 17:35:14 GMT
I think I've seen the most attractive hamons on the swords sold by Huawei and Walter Sorrels. Please let me know if there are other makers known for exquisite hamons. I'd love to see them. I think he meant the quality of the polisher, not the hamon design. I am new to swords and Japanese sword have so many terms to learn. I believe I have learned something from you on this. the hamon would show up differently depending on how it is polished. As the polisher removes some material from the blade the hamon changes. I know that the amount (thickness) of clay also can make subtle differences in tone. It seems that trying to create a certain homon polishing only would lead to an uneven feel in the surface of the blade.
I do like the design, how it looks "smoky" how the tone fades in some places and not in others. How when the wave of the hamon arches to mune, there are dark spots in the wave. Is that created by polisher or swordsmith? are they both the same person? its seems that the Japanese were about perfection and one guy couldn't master both skills?
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 19:00:55 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Jan 31, 2015 19:00:55 GMT
Hamon vary by a multitude of conditions and I don't really know much of the details, myself. "Clay" type and the thickness it's applied, steel type, steel thickness, edge geometry, quenching temperature (blade and quenchant alike) and so on all factor into what kind of hamon will develop. As for smith vs polisher, usually they are different people. I'm sure there have been cases of a smith also being a polisher, but I don't know how common that is. Any feature within the hamon is, technically, credit to the smith. Whether the blade is polished or not, those features are already present within the steel. How well they show is up to how the polisher chooses to show them. David Hofhine has a few photos up of swords that he polished just for the sake of adjusting an existing polish, that wasn't necessarily bad or even faded. Check them out here: swordpolisher.com/beforeandafter.htmlI had a hard time telling the differences, myself, until I put my nose up against my monitor and tilted my head a bit. I blame parallax for that, mostly, but the point stands that different polishes show the same stuff differently. I also recall reading an anecdote of a sword that was praised as having excellent hamon, but upon receiving a new polish the hamon had receded and become much less grand. I can't remember where I read that, though...I think it was Usagi-ya? |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 19:11:02 GMT
Post by cj7wheeler on Jan 31, 2015 19:11:02 GMT
that's very interesting. thanks for the link.
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 19:14:13 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 19:14:13 GMT
I think he meant the quality of the polisher, not the hamon design. I am new to swords and Japanese sword have so many terms to learn. I believe I have learned something from you on this. the hamon would show up differently depending on how it is polished. As the polisher removes some material from the blade the hamon changes. I know that the amount (thickness) of clay also can make subtle differences in tone. It seems that trying to create a certain homon polishing only would lead to an uneven feel in the surface of the blade.
I do like the design, how it looks "smoky" how the tone fades in some places and not in others. How when the wave of the hamon arches to mune, there are dark spots in the wave. Is that created by polisher or swordsmith? are they both the same person? its seems that the Japanese were about perfection and one guy couldn't master both skills?
I think you are referring to the 'ashi' lines where the clay temper was applied. Hope this helps :) |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 20:13:16 GMT
Post by Cottontail Customs on Jan 31, 2015 20:13:16 GMT
Just a few of the hamon pictures I've collected over the years  -Josh |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 20:29:55 GMT
Post by danmasamori on Jan 31, 2015 20:29:55 GMT
IMO, it doesn't get any better than a well executed suguha on a tama blade...
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 22:28:04 GMT
Post by Timo Nieminen on Jan 31, 2015 22:28:04 GMT
I can understand the functionally of a narrow and straight hamon but for a show blade, something just to look at. I want some beautiful hamon. I don't like show blades where function is impaired to make it pretty. Pretty without hurting function is OK, if you're into bling, but to make it functionally inferior in order to make it pretty is another thing. Of course, swordsmiths have been making too-wide hamons on Japanese swords for quite a long time, and other swordsmiths have been complaining about it. The classic complaint by Suishinshi Masahide, about 1800: www.nihontocraft.com/Suishinshi_Masahide.html(Too narrow is not good either, since then it takes fewer polishes before you run out of hardened edge. Not so much an issue for lifetime due to polishing just for general sharpening, but more an issue for repolishing if you chip the blade, when much more steel is removed compared to just sharpening.) I don't like gaudy gold plating, fancy decorated saya, etc., which make the sword "pretty", and don't hurt function. While a too-wide gaudy hamon isn't as garish as such things, it does hurt function, unlike those. IMO, worse. |
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hamon
Jan 31, 2015 23:56:09 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2015 23:56:09 GMT
I can understand the functionally of a narrow and straight hamon but for a show blade, something just to look at. I want some beautiful hamon. I don't like show blades where function is impaired to make it pretty. Pretty without hurting function is OK, if you're into bling, but to make it functionally inferior in order to make it pretty is another thing. Of course, swordsmiths have been making too-wide hamons on Japanese swords for quite a long time, and other swordsmiths have been complaining about it. The classic complaint by Suishinshi Masahide, about 1800: www.nihontocraft.com/Suishinshi_Masahide.html(Too narrow is not good either, since then it takes fewer polishes before you run out of hardened edge. Not so much an issue for lifetime due to polishing just for general sharpening, but more an issue for repolishing if you chip the blade, when much more steel is removed compared to just sharpening.) I don't like gaudy gold plating, fancy decorated saya, etc., which make the sword "pretty", and don't hurt function. While a too-wide gaudy hamon isn't as garish as such things, it does hurt function, unlike those. IMO, worse. Totally agree with Timo on this point! Once aesthetics are placed above functionality, it's no longer a real sword, but a functionally compromised 'art sword' , which defeats the purpose of constructing a sword in the first place, which is a functional tool first and foremost.
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