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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2008 18:15:29 GMT
So the chitana is clayed and iron weired and the bonfire is HOT!
In a few hours I hope it will be glowing and then I'll insert my chitana in the glow(don't know that word).
And hopefully I will be able to quench it with out it cracking, I will post later how it goes.
Any last minute advices? Still a few hour until the fire glows.
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slav
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Post by slav on Mar 13, 2008 18:25:51 GMT
Make sure to wipe off the clay from the spine of the blade! The blade already has sori (curvature), so if you don't expose the mune (spine) of the blade it will gain too much additional curvature in the quench and will definitely crack all to hell. Make sure that the water basin is long enough to be able to quench the blade horizontally, edge first. Also make sure the water is warm, not cold. Keep the tang exposed during the quench. The blade should be quenched when it is an even dull-red color. Not white-hot, and not spotty. After quenching, you MUST immediately temper the blade by evenly heating it to about 400 degrees Farenheit for an hour or so. Otherwise it will be too brittle and dangerous (see QVC Ninja video). For small blades, tempering is best done in the oven. But since yours won't fit, I guess you should "roast" it over the fire at the correct distance and temperature. Do not forget to do any of the things I have mentioned above. Good luck!!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2008 18:29:11 GMT
Thanks for the info Slav, yes there is no clay at the mune and about the water, how warm must it be? Have a karma for the help!
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slav
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Post by slav on Mar 13, 2008 18:35:40 GMT
No problem! The water should still be hot from the tap, that's all.
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Post by themaster293 on Mar 13, 2008 18:40:02 GMT
No problem! The water should still be hot from the tap, that's all. Wouldn't that be a little too hot? Hot tap water at my house can reach 130 degrees ferenhieght. I don't know about any body else's house, but the hot tap water at my house is cold compared to other houses.
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slav
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Post by slav on Mar 13, 2008 19:12:08 GMT
Well, for a human hand there is a big difference between lukewarm and 130 degrees...but relatively speaking, for a 1500 degree piece of metal...even 130 degrees is quite cool let alone lukewarm or cold water.
Using warm water is just another way to try and lessen the chances of cracking or warpage, it will still be more than cool enough to give a good heat-treat.
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Post by themaster293 on Mar 13, 2008 21:52:37 GMT
That makes sense, but didn't Gen 2 have problems with the tempering because they were quenching them in warm water?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2008 22:04:31 GMT
Operation clay quench was unsuccessful, we did not get it warm enough, but we produced a pretty neat curvature. Tomorrow we'll try again with more wood and put it in while it's still burning, because the coal did not get warm enough.
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slav
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Post by slav on Mar 13, 2008 22:12:26 GMT
Hmm. Well once the blade is in the fire, you can rapidly heat it by pointing an electric fan into the fire. A good fire needs lots of air to get steel hot enough for a heat-treat.
It also may help to dump a pile of charcoal-briquettes (like you use in a Barbecue) into the fire and let them get nice and red along with the wood coals.
Good luck!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2008 22:16:07 GMT
Ah good advices as always slavia, I'll try a fan or something to get air on it atleast, the thing is it was blowing alot when we started the fire but when it started to glow it wasn't blowing at all .
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Post by Matt993f.o.d on Mar 16, 2008 14:25:08 GMT
Which blade is this?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2008 23:56:24 GMT
What's a chitana? What colour do you have to wait for before plunging it into water? Bright yellow?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2008 0:48:46 GMT
Master: a blade I bought on ebay(let's just leave it to that >_>).
Xenemorph: a chitana is a chinese made katana ;D.
Me and my father did another tempering today, an it was successful! I clayed the katana with the stuff that is like cement that you use on walls, it's white :E(no idea what this is called in english). Wired the blade up with steel wire, let it dry for a couple of hours then inserted it in the fire when there was alot of glow but still fire on the surface. Waited until it was orange(in my eyes at least) then I quenched it in cold water, yes cold. The blade was screaming and cracking and the water was boiling.
After that I roasted it for an hour, no idea how hot it was but around 200-400C beside the coal. And quenched it in water again and it was done!
I have sand papered a small area on the blade but the file marks are so deep so my paper did not really get trough(I "moved" blade ridge around two millimeters with a file, took a good 3-4 hours), but I will grind it anyway so. But I did sense a faint hamon, so hopefully it will be more visible when I'm done with the polish and maybe some etch. Will make a new thread when I'm done with the blade.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2008 2:08:02 GMT
"Sense" the hamon? And to be clear, what you are doing is not called "a tempering", tempering is only a part of the process known entirely as heat treating, in which hardening first and tempering second is a part of.
The "stuff you use on walls that is white" is maybe spackle?
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Post by Dan Davis on Mar 17, 2008 13:35:02 GMT
I think maybe sheetrock compound?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2008 14:03:04 GMT
I am so sorry for my poor english Sam Salvati, will not happen again. Yes spackle, did not think that it had the same name in english .
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2008 0:32:27 GMT
There is nothing to apologise for I was just clearing up the use of terms.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2008 23:32:41 GMT
I have grinded the blade with a two sided whetstone and sand papered it. And I can't see a hamon, I think what I saw earlier was just reflection of light on a part that was sanded different. But I can see the small crystals in the steel just like the ones on my globalgear katana. And the steel is very hard, was the spackle not good so that the whole blade got equally hardened? The blade is not polished enough yet so there may be a faint hamon that is not visible now but I doubt it.
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Post by Dan Davis on Mar 20, 2008 14:06:28 GMT
Steel hardens when quenched, even though it is coated before heat treatment. This is especially true of modern steels and some tool steels are designed to harden quickly and completely.
Just because the steel becomes harder to work does not imply that the entire process was flawed; remember that you left the spine exposed as well as the edge so there will be a relatively minor area of softer (not soft, just softer) steel completely jacketed by hardened steel.
Hamon typically disappear when you start the polishing process and reappear when you get into the higher grit papers, so once again don't be discouraged as you may find a hamon after all.
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Post by Dan Davis on Mar 20, 2008 14:07:29 GMT
PS- look for a smaller secondary hamon along the spine
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