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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2007 15:33:45 GMT
Could Someone Perhaps put a step-by-step guide for say, tempering a knife blade? I cant figure out if I am sjupposed to quench, then temper for colors, anneal, then heat up and quench, or whatever. There does not seem to be a god guide for this that is easily translatable.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2007 18:02:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2007 4:48:22 GMT
Just heat your blade up nice and even, until a magnet does not stick and let it cool naturally to room temperature, that is called normalising. then heat it up again to non magnetic nice and even and let it soak at that temperature for about 5 minutes. Quench it into a can of vegetable or peanut oil, with the oil heated to 120F, just stick it in don't move it around only up and down IN the oil. Count to 30, then pull it out and stick it in your house oven at 400F for an hour, you are done. Polish and mount. SIMPLE WAY TO SAY IT.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2007 5:05:33 GMT
after the hour in the oven do you just let it air cool. Im guessing at somewhere around 65 degrees air temp. Just wondering cause I thinking about trying to make a file knife over christmas
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2007 5:11:47 GMT
Go to google, and look under "Making a knife from a file". There should be a good guide to making an eating dagger from an old file that tells you almost everything you need to know. I'd find it myself, but it's late here, and I'm headed to bed.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2007 14:14:41 GMT
after the hour in the oven do you just let it air cool. Im guessing at somewhere around 65 degrees air temp. Just wondering cause I thinking about trying to make a file knife over christmas Yes just pull it out of the oven and let it cool down, it doesn't need to cool to any specfific temperature like 65 or something like that, just no longer warm to the touch.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2007 16:15:16 GMT
ok cool I wasnt sure but figured that would be the case as I didn't do something stupid like put it outside in the snow. Yeah Darkintruder I read the one your talking about and it was really well put together. It was actually the one that made me really think about trying to take this on as a project. here it is www.thescholarsgarret.com/artifact/article_dagger.html
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 2:10:55 GMT
Who wants to READ about making a knife? Why not watch a video?
Part one
Part two
Part three
Part four
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 22, 2007 15:41:29 GMT
Tops thread on tempering. Good work guys.
To be specific Sam, when you say heat it till a magnet doesn't attract, can you approximate that temperature? Would it be glowing? When you oil dip that, is that actually the hardening of a previously annealed blade? Or is this thread purely about tempering an already hardened blade?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 15:48:14 GMT
I'm not sure about the exact temperature, but the steel should be roughly be a uniform orange or red.
Quenching the steel in oil at that point results in a hardened blade. It must then be tempered in a controled oven or the like so that it isn't horribly brittle.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 22, 2007 15:50:46 GMT
Gotcha, I just read that article. So that is hardening, but surely it cant be that hot. I thought they hardened at 1500 degrees C or something.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 15:52:17 GMT
It's not that hot. I annealed that knife of mine in the woodstove, since that's all I had. ;D
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 22, 2007 15:54:18 GMT
This also begs the next big question that has plagued home blade workers - After Hardening / Tempering, at what temperature can the properties of the blade be damaged. i.e. if one is sanding, grinding or sharpening a blade, how hot can you safely let it get?
And is it good or bad to keep a wet rag handy for cooling it down during the process?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 16:26:55 GMT
Brenno, the magent thing is in fact very accurate, and coincides with around 1450-1500 degrees FAHRENHEIT. it is accurate enough for most hobby guys. Yes the blade is glowing, depending on the light in your shop or space between a medium red and a low orange. When you stick it in the oil, you just put it in and leave it, don't dip in and out. When you put the non magnetic blade in the oil yes you are hardening a normalised blade. That first heat before the hardening heat is the normalising heat. Brenno they mean 1500 F not C.
After hardening and tempering the temperature the temper colors will start to run is around 450F, which will give you a straw color. It is not ruined but if it runs into the blue it can have a slightly softer spot wherever you ran that color. The wet rag is a GREAT idea.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 16:57:45 GMT
What about tempering in a forge? Do I just lie it over the dying forge fire instead of putting it in the oven?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2007 22:20:32 GMT
Tempering in the forge is VERY tricky, unless you have alot of expeirience at it. For a beginner it is best to temper in the oven.
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Post by chakobsa on Nov 22, 2007 23:50:38 GMT
Sam, great info, I particularly enjoyed the Youtube link, very interesting as it showed how anyone can get fairly decent results using basic tools, patience and a bit of elbow grease. Nice one.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2007 1:54:38 GMT
I'm pretty sure he said the hardening temperature was 800 C - but with that magnet trick, that's a good guide.
The tempering part got me confused - I don't know if it's because I didn't have the right monitor setting, but I didn't get that straw color bit at all...
still, karma for the video!
Ancalagon
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2007 3:03:20 GMT
When you temper, on roughly polished steel after the hardening quench, you will start to heat up the spine, you can see the oxidation color spectrum.
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Post by Dan Davis on Nov 24, 2007 22:41:42 GMT
The tempering part got me confused - I don't know if it's because I didn't have the right monitor setting, but I didn't get that straw color bit at all... Ancalagon Get a short piece of steel rod from the hardware store, sand it shiny, then lay it across the burner of your oven and turn on the heat. As the piece of steel heats up it will run through the colors up to deep purple. Carefully pick up the rod, rinse it in the sink to cool it off, sand it bright and repeat. Do that 2-3 times and you'll have a good handle on tempering by color. Try not to burn yourself too badly.
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