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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 0:28:18 GMT
with a real differential hardening and decent fittings? i know its pretty useless for cutting but its kinda a novelty item id like to have....maybe huawei swords could make one...hmmm
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SanMarc
Senior Forumite
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Post by SanMarc on Mar 26, 2011 0:34:07 GMT
Only TH, you can cut with it, like a sythe.......SanMarc.
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 0:38:36 GMT
darn no diferential hardened one huh :/
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SanMarc
Senior Forumite
Posts: 3,193
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Post by SanMarc on Mar 26, 2011 0:41:10 GMT
Nope, you will be the first!!!
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 0:56:31 GMT
that would be cool. to have the only one. hahhahaa
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Mar 26, 2011 1:15:53 GMT
A what?
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SanMarc
Senior Forumite
Posts: 3,193
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Post by SanMarc on Mar 26, 2011 1:20:21 GMT
Sabato, Japanese Anime, Kenshin Ronshi, I cant remember the exact name, but I got one, Kool Anime....SanMarc.
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 1:34:25 GMT
its a katana that is sharpened on the Mune instead of the Ha
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Post by frankthebunny on Mar 26, 2011 1:37:07 GMT
I was curious myself and after a little searching I found this explanation as to why differential heating cannot be done. at least not safely.
"It is metallurgically impossible to create a 'Sakaba' (reversed edge) katana that would hold up in battle. Let me explain:
A katana is a wonderfully durable sword for its size. This is because the process of differential forging gives the blade a harder edge and a softer spine. The hardness of metal is measured in Rockwells, or RC's. Most katanas hold a 60-70 RC edge and a 40-50 RC spine. The edge is harder so the blade wont dull, and the spine softer to absorb shock. You may think that you would end up with a softer edge in a reversed blade, but who cares right? The whole point is that you wont be using the edge much. But no, it is impossible to heat treat a katana to give higher RC's to the thicker side than the thinner. You would get a sword with the proper RC placement, higher in the edge and lower in the spine. That would make the sword brittle, since the spine (now that the edge is the spine, on the reverse blade), would be very brittle. Your sword would crack.
But it wouldnt even get to that point if you wanted the sword folded. Folding the sword (forging the metal in folds, hammering the blade back on itself many times over again) makes it many times stronger (not to mention way more expensive). Every katana for most of the reign of samurai was folded. The problem here is that in the folding process the structure of the katana doesnt allow for any curve unless it curves back on the thicker, dull side. This same problem arrises even when a blade is not folded. The shape and process of forging a sword demands for the edge to be forward. Which means you couldnt make a folded reverse blade sword, if even just for looks.
Your last problem would be price and willingness of the sword smith. Even a non folded sword, as I said above, with a reverse edge, would be nearly impossible to make. You would probably end up with a dull blade that would be extremely hard to sharpen, a lumpy frontmost part, and terrible customization of the handle. And the swordsmith would still demand a hell of a lot of money. I used to apprentice for a smith for a short time, its extremely hard work even for your average non folded katana. This project would leave you with a sword that could only be used for display, but that would be too ugly to display, and a huge bill.
Oh yeah, the tsuka (handle) would be another problem. Most blades carry their edge down into the tsuka, or atleast into the habaki (metal part between the tsuba and blade). If the edge was reversed it would bite into the metal and wood, and may cause a lot of damage not only to the blade, but to one's own body (but again, you could never fight with a sword like this, therefore you wouldnt have to worrty about that)."
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Post by Student of Sword on Mar 26, 2011 1:47:22 GMT
Imagine doing noto with it. :lol:
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Post by frankthebunny on Mar 26, 2011 1:58:42 GMT
yeah, lol you only get one shot and the blade would never even make it into the saya. if there was ever a thing such as a traditional samurai prank this would probably be one of the all time worst ones. "hey joe san, show the others how good you are at performing noto in the dark"
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Post by MOK on Mar 26, 2011 2:04:46 GMT
That really doesn't seem like the most knowledgeable of sources. Most of what is said there is just plain not true.
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Post by Larry Jordan on Mar 26, 2011 2:21:22 GMT
Firearm equivalent  |
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 2:44:40 GMT
i agree MOK....for one reason...through hardened reverse blade swords do exist, functional ones at that. and they are by no means ugly messed up looking things, i also saw a reverse blade wakizashi made by walter sorrells with a differential hardening...if walter made it it must be safe...Lol.
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Post by frankthebunny on Mar 26, 2011 2:51:55 GMT
never said it was
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Mar 26, 2011 2:56:14 GMT
this is true. any online info should be yaken w/ a grain of salt
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SanMarc
Senior Forumite
Posts: 3,193
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Post by SanMarc on Mar 26, 2011 4:02:58 GMT
The reverse blade is just a katana that has the sori going the other way, Kissaki is reversed that's it, and you carry it tachi style, so it can still be Notoed, (SP)  The purpose of the sabato is to beat your opponent up without killing him, although you still could, it was a worse fate than death to be beaten so, most defeated Samuri would commit "Seppaku" after any way, so there ya go. The guy who I got my Sabato from went out to his large over grown back yard and used it to cut down EVERY thing, I had to straighten it a little and it has some nicks in the cutting edge, but it held it's own, like I said, you can cut with it like a Scythe, The thick back edge is to humilitate your opponents...Kinda like Mushasi did with two sticks.....Sanmarc. |
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Post by iealchemist on Mar 26, 2011 7:00:35 GMT
The whole "Can't DH with a harder spine" makes some sense, since it is the spine that is under compression, hence needs more strength. Using it like a scythe is no problem, but hitting with the blunt end would put the harder/weaker side under compression.
I'm fairly sure that Walter Sorrels wakizashi is meant to be used with the sharp side, not the blunt one.
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Post by Hiroshi on Mar 26, 2011 7:45:50 GMT
I think what it really boils down to is the way the blade is DH. When the blade is hardened the metal Certin parts expand. In Order to get the blade to curve the right direction the metal would have to contract where it normally expands and expand where it normally contracts.
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SeanF
Member
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Post by SeanF on Mar 26, 2011 8:24:05 GMT
I can't see why there would be any problem with this. Correct me if I am wrong, but it is essentially making a blade with a negative sori. (Blade curvature). Since the DH process does impart some curve you would just have to take that into account when making the blade blank. The only problem I can see is finding someone to make it.
Unless I am missing something.
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The purpose of the sabato is to beat your opponent up without killing him, although you still could, it was a worse fate than death to be beaten so, most defeated Samuri would commit "Seppaku" after any way, so there ya go.
