Oniyuri" 9260 Bujinkan Katana w/ Bo Hi

I don't practice any Ninjutsu or any other Japanese sword martial art like Iaido, but I have a solid bodied Oniyuri, and my younger brother has a Hanwei Ninjato. Looking at them right now to make a better comparison than I'd make if I were going off the top of my head.

The Hanwei seems to have a thinner blade, and isn't as wide as the Oniyuri, so the Hanwei feels lighter... but I wouldn't know how it'd feel compared to the bo-hi version. The blade on the Oniyuri is also a tiny bit longer than the Hanwei, about an inch.

The tsuka on the Oniyuri is also quite a bit longer than the Hanwei Ninjato, with the Oniyuri at round 14" and the ninjato at around 10". The heavier weight on the oniyuri is probably increased by the added length of the tang.
The P.O.B. on the Oniyuri seems to be around 3" from the guard, and the Hanwei is about 5" from the guard. So, while the Oniyuri has a closer balance, I feel that the Hanwei just handles better because it's lighter.

While the Oniyuri might have better quality materials, with the real rayskin (the fake rayskin on the Hanwei is a bit of an eyesore), and whatever the fittings are made of (I think the Cheness has a brass tsuba, and the Hanwei... I have no clue what its tsuba is made of), I feel as though Hanwei make a better and more attractive product when comparing these two. The Cheness has some pretty ugly 'gear-cog' seppa, the kissaki polish is abysmal, and I'm just not quite used to the extra length of the tsuka. The polish on the Hanwei is a sort of mirror-ish finish on the flat of the blade, with the edge polished with a sort of satin-like finish, which the polish kissaki (? Dunno if that would be correctly called that, it's more of a American tanto sort of point) matches. I didn't quite like the acid-etched hamon on the Oniyuri, and actually prefer the etching on the Hanwei. The Hanwei has that little part of the hamon that's darker at the outside of the hamon, while the Oniyuri doesn't. The Oniyuri's tsukamaki doesn't alternate, but oddly enough the Hanwei does, even with its lower price and synthetic suede-like material (which I oddly like the feel of). The diamonds on the wrap are smaller and more even with the Oniyuri, however. I do not know if all Hanwei products have alternating ito or not, and I doubt it really means much at the end of the day, especially if we're talking about function and durability, which the Oniyuri does not seem to lack. It just ain't pretty, is what I think. Oh, and the Hanwei doesn't get much in the way of edge durability, I think. It's really thin and sharp at the edge, which would make it easier to ding up, but makes it hella fun to do some bottle cutting. My brother's has a ding/chip on the edge from hitting a little wrought iron post. I'm pretty sure any sword would have damage from that, but maybe the Hanwei took even more damage because of that thin edge. I'd think that the Cheness would make a better work-horse than the Hanwei.

I personally would not recommend using a sword for digging or climbing and such, as I doubt that'd be good for your blade, but like I said, I don't practice ninjutsu and can't really say what you should or should not do in that. When it comes to blade on blade contact, what I do know is that if you hit them edge to edge, it will get damaged, especially if it's sharp. I wouldn't know what it is your school does though. Maybe use stage combat blunts or whatever they have for katana in that end? Just sayin', be careful. I don't want to hear about any grievous injuries to my sword-obsessed brethren.

Whoops, got a bit more long-winded than I intended to. Hope you could extract some useful information from that wall of text. Oh, and have fun! ;D

@canaduh69
I guess I should interject here as I am the person responsible for the Cheness 'Oni' series. As I have stated before, in spite of what some detractors and skeptics have posted here, the original 'Oni' series was indeed patterned off of a sword in Hatsumi Sensei's collection. The Shorter style blade is particular to the kenjutsu of Togakure-Ryu. The other Ryu ha in Bujinkan use regular sized blades. I designed the series at the behest of Sensei Andy Martin of Los Angeles Bujinakan with teh approval of Hatsumi Sensei. Now, the Oniyuri is NOT the original design. The original Oni series by Cheness had a standard 11" tsuka and I designed it without Bo-hi. The Oniyuri was in response to Bujinkan practitioners asking for the longer 14" Tsuka which would be more reminiscent of Older blades and styles. The design scheme is based on time period. If you adhere to the normal looking sword while sheathed concept then the first series (like Hatsumi Sensei's original) would be more of a late Sengyoku period/early Edo period configuration while the longer tsuka would be more in keeping with the Gyokko and Kyukushinden Ryu which were the older battlefield styles (ie in armor). The issue is that the two ryu-ha mentioned tend to favor full size blades HOWEVER the Oniyuri is designed to LOOK like these period blades while sheathed but utilizing the kenjutsu of Togakure-ryu instead. I have never claimed that the longer handled version was modeled after anything in anyones possesion, only the first version. The second version was approved by the Bujinkan as being a logical extension of the concept and art appropriate. It has bemused me to see all of these other vendors selling their versions and using the 'modeled after' ad copy when all they did was copy what we did without any approval from anyone.
Our goal was to supply Ninpo practitioners with an affordable, authentic 'live' tool to use in their studies and I think I succeeded. Even Paul was originally somewhat skeptical as to how well this line would do and it has become one of his all time best sellers so I must have done SOMETHING right. In the future i plan to market higher quality Ninpo equipment including swords (with traditional materials and fittings appropriate to ryu ha), Kusarigama, Kyogetsu Shoge and Shikomezue...these will not be 'beaters' but copies of originals in private collections including a rare yamagatana.
Hope this helps.
Ninpo Ikkan!
Don

Thank you.

I would buy a hanwei over anything offered by cheness any day of the week and though they are not traditional I do like straight bladed swords I just don't like that every idiot going equates them to ninjas. I have practiced ninjutsu, I'm not sure how you define what is "true" or not because the ninja were all about misdirection and deceit. Also if you equate "true" ninjutsu as anything to do with Hatsumi then I am going to disagree with you. Now that I've opened up the can of worms I might need my flame retardant suit.

LOL, no, you havent opened any cams of worms. Ninjutsu is all what the student interupts it. You get out of it what you seek.

By true I mean we practise everything from fighting in a creek bed, to underwater, in trees, on snow, in extreme heat (yes, we have extreme heat up here in canada, LOL), in back alleys, hallways, roof tops, elevators and in many, many different environments ans ituations. We aren't like most dojos who only train in a dojo 2 hours a day 2 or 3 days a week. We go out into our environment and we learn to use it. Ninjutsu is not about sparring in a dojo IMO, it's a lifestyle. It is about adapting.
Make sense? I hope I explained it better from my point of view.

Anywho, we are drastically off topic. I would love to discuss this further but we should pick an appropriate forum to discuss it in, yes? no?

Dom T

I too would love to have met and spoke with Takamatsu Toshitsugu. Mo-ko "The Mongolian Tiger" lives on in Hatsumi. Hatsumi trained with him and prides himself on carrying on his teachings. Could you imagine getting to just pick his brain for a couple hours and hear his stories? It would be amazing.

GOOD LORD! I don't know how much that's in USD exactly, but USD and CAD are real close, so JEEZ. That guy clearly just wanted to make an easy buck offa you, IMO. I understand dropping that kind of green for something from a well-known smith, but from a relatively unknown guy.... I dunno, I think I'd have to charge cheap as an unknown smith. ...Unless the materials used were real expensive, but I somehow doubt that with that guy.

He definately makes a commission. Metal is pretty expensive here for example, red brass is worth $6.00 a pound.
The dude is a ripoff because he knows the only way to get decent quality is to bring it in and he "claims" his time is worth $30 and hour. In Canada, Blacksmiths make ALOT per hour. I can guess around $75.00 an hour for a real blacksmith who does it full time. I can't even say for sure whther this guy is a real blacksmith or not because $30.00 an hour is pretty low.

He doesnt treat his "OK" swords, they are simple stock metal. Thats why they break and bend so easily but most people here don't know there are other options, this guy is there and has them made so they are bought quickly. I was naieve for many years as well.....not anymore thanks to this website I stumbled upon.
I will give you an example of the costs associated with my training here.
A simple Gi, is $125.00 ( I go through 1 a year, sometimes 2)
Leg wrappings $65.00
Tabis $95.00 ( I go through 1 pair a year)
Training for 1 month $300.00
Those are just the basic startup costs required to train.
This doesn't include different color gi's for different environments, practise weapons, travel expenses etc. It is expensive for sure.

Students purchase out of guilt, our sensei sells so easily because he emphasizes how the sales support the dojo. He is a really good sensei, but he is a better businessman.
He runs his dojo as his main means of support. I cant really fault him for making a living, I simply go elsewhere now for my equipment.

My sensei won't do anything for anyone if he doesnt make a buck off it, LOL! We always joke he would charge us to sweat on his floor if he could figure out how. But god bless him, he has a family to support, he is an amazing teacher and he is the most solid man I know who will have my back in any situation for any reason. But he's Italian and you know who our Italian friends like their cash!

I did take the literature on the Oniyuri to the dojo and even my sensei is interested. He is looking into the validity of the "Bunjikan claim" and if he gets the right answer, he is going to purchase one.
He admitted he had never heard of this sword before and now he is definately interested.

GOOD GOD. Well, it doesn't sound like either of them are going out of business any time soon, with those prices, and the fact that people are still paying them.

I can't sweat gold either, BW. LOL. I definitely can't afford that, since I barely make $300 a month with my current part-time job.

300 a month? How many times a week?