Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2009 23:25:13 GMT
I remember someone mentioning, then I saw the pictures and desciption. There was a japanese swordsmith who broke up cast iron pots and stacked them with iron nails, then forged that into a billet and ended up with about 1070.
|
|
|
Post by randomnobody on Dec 12, 2009 23:59:30 GMT
I remember hearing/reading about that. Never seen any pictures, at least not the finished product now that I think of it I may have seen some of the early steps...
Interesting method, recycling for the hardcore.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2009 18:55:04 GMT
It can serve a purpose. For example say the only material that you have to work with was mild sheet and reallllly high carbon sheet yet you needed to make a durable blade. Make a stack of the two materials and the carbon can migrate and produce a blade that has a carbon level somewhere in the middle...other then that type of thing I am not sure that there is a modern day use other then looks. Saying this, I am sure someone will correct me. It's not incorrect, though modern smiths generally have access to good enough steel this isn't neccessary. Today, it's almost entirely done for the aestetic value, and I'm sure that was an important aspect in times of old as well. Depending on exactly what you are making, it might even result in a less durable material. The way I was taught, you put in altering layers of nickel and steel, since this results in a very clear pattern when etched. I don't know if the nickel makes the blade more fragile, but I seriously doubt it helps making it stronger.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2009 18:38:45 GMT
Wow...thanks guys, this is all great stuff!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2009 4:55:12 GMT
Type "mosaic damascus" or "explosion damascus" into Google prepare to have your mind blown.searching "mosaic damascus" was educational. The other option just talked about a suicide bomber dismantling himself on the side of a bus in Syria.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2009 5:21:04 GMT
It's not incorrect, though modern smiths generally have access to good enough steel this isn't neccessary. Today, it's almost entirely done for the aestetic value, and I'm sure that was an important aspect in times of old as well. Depending on exactly what you are making, it might even result in a less durable material. The way I was taught, you put in altering layers of nickel and steel, since this results in a very clear pattern when etched. I don't know if the nickel makes the blade more fragile, but I seriously doubt it helps making it stronger. The nickel and steel is one way, but can be tricky to weld. The more common way is to weld a high manganse steel together with a high nickel steel, like 1084 and 15n20, That way they etch light and dark and ar both steel, not pure nickel to steel, which in the pure nickel layers leave a softspot.
|
|
|
Post by Matthew Stagmer on Dec 15, 2009 14:08:12 GMT
It can serve a purpose. For example say the only material that you have to work with was mild sheet and reallllly high carbon sheet yet you needed to make a durable blade. Make a stack of the two materials and the carbon can migrate and produce a blade that has a carbon level somewhere in the middle...other then that type of thing I am not sure that there is a modern day use other then looks. Saying this, I am sure someone will correct me. It's not incorrect, though modern smiths generally have access to good enough steel this isn't neccessary. Today, it's almost entirely done for the aestetic value, and I'm sure that was an important aspect in times of old as well. Depending on exactly what you are making, it might even result in a less durable material. The way I was taught, you put in altering layers of nickel and steel, since this results in a very clear pattern when etched. I don't know if the nickel makes the blade more fragile, but I seriously doubt it helps making it stronger. I think most nothern americans are spoiled. I was in Key West doing a demo at Fort Zachery taylor and they had very limmited steel. They often have to forge weld some pieces together just to get something thick. I cant imagine the issues more remote places have with getting material. Point is that is almost always for the look but it is still a needed skill in some places.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2009 14:19:54 GMT
Try being in Australia mate, our steel comes from the anything we can pull off of the burnt out husks around the place in the outback, of course it is a little more difficult when someone is living in it, you have to rip and run
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2009 2:45:19 GMT
Try being in Australia mate, our steel comes from the anything we can pull off of the burnt out husks around the place in the outback, of course it is a little more difficult when someone is living in it, you have to rip and run What you describe sounds a lot like Mad Max. Dudes booby trapping their steel supply so that Lord Humongous and his drifters don't kill them for it and sell it to Master Blaster in BarterTown.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2009 20:19:44 GMT
searching "mosaic damascus" was educational. The other option just talked about a suicide bomber dismantling himself on the side of a bus in Syria. Ah, you need to use the image search, not the regular one. My bad - I mostly just use Google to look for images, so I assumed others would do the same. I think most nothern americans are spoiled. I was in Key West doing a demo at Fort Zachery taylor and they had very limmited steel. They often have to forge weld some pieces together just to get something thick. I cant imagine the issues more remote places have with getting material. Point is that is almost always for the look but it is still a needed skill in some places. Being Swedish, I'm afraid I don't know enough about the American or international market to say.
|
|
Brett Whinnen
Member
I know enough to know I still know nothing
Posts: 208
|
Post by Brett Whinnen on Dec 17, 2009 22:56:02 GMT
The loss of carbon has to do with how many times you heat it not how many times you fold. There are ways of adding carbon back in aswell. So tech you could fold a piece 1,000,000,000 times or more if you wanted to. The paper fold thing doesn't work here becuase when you fold steel you then forge it back out a ways and fold again. With paper there is no re-shaping or drawing back out. Did that make sence? Matthew, is that how many times you heat it from cold or how many times it goes back into the forge to reheat between foldings?
|
|