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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2007 4:18:59 GMT
I just got 2 Musashi swords a couple weeks ago.
My Elven King Sword should be here in the near future. (out of stock when I ordered)
I am working on those reviews haven't had time to do any real cutting other than the boxes they came in
and Now I am REALLY having trouble NOT ordering this too
I know Paul had great things to say about this sword, but I was curious if any other forumites had handled or cut with this sword.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 0:51:45 GMT
Not yet, but I gotta tell you just based off of Paul's review it's high on the long, long list of what's next.
-John
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 3:47:30 GMT
I am considering getting the Paul Chen Knightly. I would love to hear anythoughts you have regarding durability ahead of your review. Also can you comment on the blade stiffness. Do you find it wobbly?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 5:25:49 GMT
I wish somebody would give the Musashi Ninjato a go. Please, don't force me to buy one myself, as I'm trying hard to refocus on my western sword roots! ;D www.musashiswords.com/shop/product.php?productid=12&cat=0&page=1 The blade is longer than the typical ninjato blade (and it lacks the Cold Steel Tanto style tip), but since the ninjato itself is a made up sword, I can live with that. ;D
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 13:14:48 GMT
I had a hard time choosing between the Paul Chen and Masahiro Ninja, but our Paul's review made up my mind ;D
Ordered the black Paul Chen today from Eblades (per Paul's recommendations on where to buy plus color to get) .......I couldn't help myself
The addiction is getting worse...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 15:01:38 GMT
Tsafa,
I expect the sword to come in wed. or thurs.
As soon as I recieve it I will post "first impressions"
with a review to follow
I got like 3 of them to do, I guess I have a weekend of cutting and pictures planned so I can get these out to you guys.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2007 16:03:31 GMT
I want one of those Cheness Demon Lily Bujinkan ninjato. That's a mean looking mofo.
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Post by sol on Apr 16, 2007 22:15:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2007 17:44:51 GMT
They charge $44 more for the black one, I guess thats indicitive of the higher want for the black same.
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Post by manman on Apr 20, 2007 2:42:48 GMT
nice
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2007 3:09:08 GMT
I am a practioner of the Bujinkan. (more commonly known as a shinobi or ninja)
As Paul pointed out in his review, we in the Bujinkan debate this a lot and Hatsumi, or Soke (Grandmaster or, more literally, Head Master) has given us what seems to be the most likely scenario:
We use ninjato (shinobigatana or ninja ken is more often used in our dojo) which are identical to the Cheness Oniyuri (I own and use this sword in the Bujinkan). This seems to be the most commonly used ninjato in history. The short blade in a long saya (scabbard) is helpful in the timing and speed of our techniques. The short blade also helps in range control and for use in tight quarters. The long tsuka is also helpful for many techniques and to gain more range when needed, or lose it as needed. (same with power)
The second most common style used, and where the straight blade idea comes from, is simply this: A lot of shinobi were poor commoners. They were not, of course, rich and powerful samurai (since shinobi often stood against the samurai). They couldn't just go to the nearest smith and request a blade made to their specifications and such because it would have been illegal to own it, being a commoner, and they couldn't have afforded it! So how did they get their swords? They made them themselves. However, without the proper training the smiths had, they usually just ended up stealing a strip of scrap or junk metal (sometimes they'd luck out and get a defective sword) and grind it down themselves to make a rough edge.
The blade of a katana is straight up until the hardening process. The differential hardening process makes the blade curve as it heats up and cools due to the metal heating and cooling at different rates. Think of it like putting a piece of tape on one side of a long ballon and blowing it up. The commoner could not harden his blade properly, so it usually ended up straight.
The third type was just a katana that was inherited, or stolen off a battle-field or crypt. This is not dishonorable to us. You have to remember that ninja, in our training, learn to see the world differently. To the samurai a katana is a symbol of authority and power. It is even an icon of spiritual significance. To involve one even as the object of a theft, is dishonorable to the sword and to the samurai who weilded it. To us it is merely a tool. A means to an end.
Another thing to remember is this: To truly have a shinobigatana you must fight like a shinobi with it. If you are trained in whatever-ryu and you try using a ninjato with it then you're just a whatever-ryu practioner with a different sword. This becomes immediately apparent when I visit other dojo with my friends. On first sight it looks just like I am carrying a regular katana in my belt. However, as soon as the tatami is set up and I allow the instructor to practice a cut with my blade it stands out like a sore-thumb. He's a kendo artist with a short blade. He is not a ninja and it is not a ninjato.
Anyway, just some history and thoughts... L.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2007 16:53:24 GMT
I must admit I feel more at home with a Kama in my hand than a sword, but I have acquired a couple books by Stephen Hayes
namely: Ninjutsu The Art of the Invisible Warrior and Enlightened Warrior Gyo-Ja handbook for daily practice.
trying to use these as training tools, as the ninjutsu schools in my area seem to be more motivated by money than quality of student.
Any books or training techniques you could recommend would be greatly appreciated.
(due to shipping delays I will get the sword Tuesday the 24th) My first differentially hardend blade.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2007 18:24:21 GMT
I'm not a fan of most bujinkan guys... they have like... 15 levels of black belt... so really 10th Dan sounds impressive, but it's only 2/3 the way to the top, which is the equivalent to 5th or 6th dan in most other martial systems(where generally the most skilled members worldwide are 8th or in some rarer cases, 9th dan. There is 1 living Aikido 10th dan, though I doubt any others will be promoted after he dies).
Also, while I'm am the first to admit the effectiveness of several of the Ryu taught in the bujinkan, others(there are 9 total) are far more questionable. Masaaki Hatsumi, the soke of all 9 of the bujinkan ryu has failed many times to validate his certificates for a number of his martial arts. Read about it at wikipedia, and also Bullshido.
That being said, be careful of a lot of the books on 'ninjutsu', especially ones with silly titles, for example: "Ninja Mind Control" by Ashida Kim(a ridiculous fellow, search him up...it's silly).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2007 22:32:57 GMT
Justin - I'll gladly compile some information for you. ^-^ No worries. I'll post it here when it's ready and send you a PM so you'll know it's up. Adam - We all know what you mean. Most Bujinkan guys are just laughable. However, we do have a lot of serious practicioners. For you information - Bujikan has 15 dan, but the last five are levels of Shihan. We of the 5 levels represents one of the five elements recognized by shinobi. I don't remember them in their level of importance, but they are: Fire, Earth, Wind, Water, and Void. (I think that's right. I know Void is the highest level, but I thought wood was in there somewhere also...) There are 9 schools we advertise, but there are a total of 18. I do not like Hatsumi much either. I prefer Takamatsu-sama. We all know what you mean also by saying "most" Bujinkan guys. You hate them all except me. That's cool. I have lots of fans and it's nice to know you want to be my number one fan. It's cool. I appreciate it. Lol L.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2007 2:27:15 GMT
L.Draegon - Thanks alot man.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2007 2:29:04 GMT
I'm glad you were civil about that, I felt almost offensive when I said that, especially since being an Aikidoka, I get a lot of cheek from loser-bullies about my 'sissy' martial art. And I agree that many, MANY aikidoka don't train very well at all. I'm fortunate that my sensei is experienced in other martial arts, and has a good understanding of practical application as well as the textbook forms of the techniques.
In Aikido, if you're japanese, you're promoted to Shihan upon attaining your 6th dan. If you're a white guy(or anything other than Japanese), you have to be extra amazing in addition to getting a 6th dan. Real aikido tests are very very difficult to pass, especially after Shodan. The highest test for which a 'technical' test is given is Godan, after that you have to really stand out and be amazing and contribute to the art worldwide in order to advance. Like I said, there's not many Rokudans, Nanadans, or Hachidans left. I think there's a handful of 9th dans and of course Tohei Sensei Judan.
Anyway, what I'm trying to say here is that a 10th dan Bujinkan is not roughtly the equivalent to a 10th dan Aikido. In aikido, the 8th and 9th dans are like 15th dans in Bujinkan. A 10th dan bujinkan is like a 5th or 6th dan in Aikido(it roughly correlates to the Shihan level as well). which is not to say Aikido is a better art, it just doesn't divide competency levels as much as Bujinkan.
It's different still for every other art. In Kendo, there are no Shihan, rather there are Hanshi Hachidans, i.e. Hachidans who are particularly dedicated and skilled who are promoted to Hanshi. Generally to get Hanshi, you have to first get Renshi and Kyoshi. Anyway, I think I'm rambling now, but you get my point.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2007 19:33:47 GMT
Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu 101The basics of Bujinkan:The first thing you need to understand is that Bujinkan is a weapons based art. This means several things:
- Any and every technique can be done with or without a weapon
- Any and every technique can be done with any weapon.
- Fighting an armed opponent is almost exactly the same as fighting an unarmed opponent. The only real difference is distance and timing.
However, the first thing you learn is Taijutsu, or unarmed combat. Your weapon skills cannot surpass your unarmed skills because all weapon skills are directly linked to unarmed skills. Taijutsu - The Unarmed ArtTaijutsu is solidly founded on two principles: Distance and Timing.
- Distance - You need to learn to maintain proper distance. You should be close enough to your opponent that they can feel like they can hit you, but still be just out of reach. If you are too close then it doesn't matter how good your timing is because you'll be hit. If you're too far then you have to waste time closing the distance.
- Timing - Second, but no less important than distance is. Fights happen with a rhythm, like a fine piece of music or dance. However, we learn to break this rhythm to our own advantage. Usually fights happen where opponent 1 makes a move (1), opponent 2 makes his move (2), then opponent 1 makes his move (3) over and over until the fight is over. In between each of these moves is a solid pause where an AND takes place. Therefore a fight, no matter how fast, goes 1 AND 2 AND 3 AND 4 AND 5... and so on. In Bujinkan you learn to attack on the AND. So a Bujikan fight follows thus 1 ATTACK - Not 1 AND
As you fight you will inevitably want to fight with speed and power. This is not how we do it. Practice with slow and gentle movements. You should not be moving fast. Your breathing should not speed up. You should be utterly relaxed and moving at a normal pace. Fights in Bujinkan often look like one guy is trying to swat at air while the other guy (the shinobi) walks around his opponent making small corrections here... and here... and then suddenly his opponent falls to the ground in a vortex of pain and misery. (I don't care what anyone says - Bujinkan hurts badly. No matter how gentle or softly your opponent attacks you back you end up in a world of pain.) Really there are simply too many things to list. There's distance and timing, sure, but there is also creating illusions using imaginary targets, the subtle movements we make as punches fly past our faces, etc. I cannot stress enough how much you need an instructor. You can at least study our philosophies though. A lot of them are helpful in more areas than just combat. Indeed, ninpo is a lifestyle, not just a martial art in the modern sense of the word. Old martial arts systems are ways of life. You select one to suit you and your needs. I try and follow Bujinkan as closely as I can and it seems to work well. Anything by Masaaki Hatsumi (The way of the ninja: Secret techniques / Japanese Sword Fighting: Secrets of the Samurai (you'll love that one...) / etc) Start on those first. There are a lot by him and they'll help you a lot. Something you need to know is that these books are not instruction manuals. They're only really meaningful if you've studied Bujinkan in it's physical form also. Soke has a way of talking about seemingly unimportant things that really are crucial, so unless you have a lot guidance you might get lost. Of course, I am still studying myself. We're always still learning and studying; however, feel free to PM me at anytime if you have questions or comments. I'm sitting here now trying to think of what all I need to say. There is so much I can't even think of how to put it all out... Oh well. I'll keep expanding this article as I think of what else to introduce in what order... Adam: No problem. If you're competent in your art of choice and you enjoy it and fully support it then there is no reason to bicker or argue about it with others. Any art or sport can be dangerous in the hands of an experienced practioner. Also, another thing to remember, opinions are like armpits - everyone has one and some stink. I do not disagree with you that some of our doctrine and such is a little... 0_o (for lack of a better word), but I have been in several fights since I have joined the Bujinkan and I love the way I fight instinctively instead of having to think and muscle through every move. In return, I do not much like Aikido (thus, I do not practice it), but I do not have a problem with those who practice it. To each his own I suppose. L.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2007 6:13:06 GMT
It is interesting the relationship between weapons and unarmed techniques the way you put it. The Aikido my Sensei teaches is Iwama Ryu, i.e. the style taught by Morihiro Saito Sensei at the Iwama Shrine. When Iwama Split with the Aikikai, any dojos affiliated with Iwama could choose who they wanted their hombu to be, we stuck with the Aikikai, but we're still Iwama.
of course, my sensei also has studied under a number of masters a great deal, and has experience with Saotome's style through his student Ikeda, and also a very soft more 'ki' focuses style, reminiscent of Tohei's, so we get a good blend.
My point is Saito Sensei had a very similar view on weapons and techniques. In our system, most of the unarmed movements and techniques come directly from the weapon work. Weapons are also incidental to techniques, which means either person - the thrower or the throwee(nage and uke in aikido) could have a weapon and the technique would be the same, save for some minor differences in the actual body contact(if I'm holding a sword as I get you in the joint lock, the technique execution will be a little different as I have to hold you in a different way. The effect on you however is exactly the same).
Shoji Nishio(quite the martial artist, look him up) also developed a very weapons based style, though his codified weapons forms has little similarities to Saito's.
Of course in Aikido, the only weapons we commonly train are Bokken, Jo, and Tanto. The principles are sound however, and can be applied to any weapon.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2007 15:03:08 GMT
My Paul Chen Ninja arrived 15 minutes ago (I am at work) So I immediately shut the door to my office and closed the blinds : ) My first impressions: 1. the blade has 3 "tier-like" bevels 2. Blade thickness tapers as it gets to the very mean looking tip, but has a good thickness to it. 3. the black on black handle is amazing (pictures do no do it justice) 4. the Ito is wrapped very tightly (Paul's was a tad loose if I remember correctly) 5. The natural hamon is very a straight line, almost no waves. 6. The saya is wonderfully done, I spent almost as much time looking at it, as I did the sword itself. 7. It came very sharp, I placed my finger barely on the edge and just thought about moving it, when i felt it "bite" me. (did cut unsupported paper xerox sheet) I cannot wait to start cutting with it. Review will be done this weekend on it and others I have been putting off. (by the way karma to L. Draegon for all his help in gathering information and for his recommendations)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2007 21:51:20 GMT
Does the "by th sword" website have good ratings? Paul said that some were cheap for they were factory rejects. if someone could vouch for this place that would be great.
Thanks
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