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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 4:11:36 GMT
I was under the assumption (and tutilage) that the stirrup did not enable the cavalry charge so much as the high back saddle.
M.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 8:38:40 GMT
A stirrup allows you to stand up in the saddle to handle a lance, shield,or what ever weapon while moving without it,it is very hard to stay on a horse without falling off. In a cavalry charge it allows you to stand up lean forward into the lance. Using a bow stand up so you won't bounce and ruin your aim.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 13:53:36 GMT
I've been looking for a copy of that sword since the movie came out- I know there's probably no historical precedent for such a sword but you gotta admit, its very cool looking, with a slight Celt/Viking styling to the hilt and blade.
There's a guy on eBay, Von Sussen, who has a brass-hilted sword for sale...it looks somewhat like this one, but not as broad or as cool. If anyone knows of these being made, let us know!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 14:38:27 GMT
i know i could carve and mold the fittings, but blades i am not up on just as of yet... paladin do you have a link to the ebay sword? we could tear something apart and build it back up...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 14:45:32 GMT
The only weapon the stirrup is absolutely necessary for is the Lance. On impact, without the stirrup, you can't brace, or put the horse's weight into the charge. Without the added weight of the horse, you have very little impact. Without bracing, instead of piercing your target, you go flying backwards.
There is no such thing as eliminating the "bounce" when riding a horse. You can cushion it a little by absorbing some of it in your knees, but it's not much. Fighting in melee without stirrups always ends up with everyone on foot, eventually, which is why cavalry didn't become the central focus of most armies until the middle ages. It just wasn't That effective. And horse archers, well, they predate the lancer by centuries.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 16:10:11 GMT
Have you rode a horse I have with and without a saddle. Without a stirrup see it is hard it is to shift your weight one side to the other without falling off. Take a good hard swing with something weight without a saddle and stirrup see how hard it is to stay on. No you can't complete eliminate bonce but you can get rid of alot of it with stirrups. To rope you stand up in the stirrup to get rid of as much bonce as you can so you can get an accurate throw.
If some managed to stike a blow to your person you will fall off without a stirrup. You have a good chance of staying on with them.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 16:17:08 GMT
i know i could carve and mold the fittings, but blades i am not up on just as of yet... paladin do you have a link to the ebay sword? we could tear something apart and build it back up... Hey Irish I looked; it looks as if he's closed his store - maybe temporarily as he's gotten over 23000 in feedback; can't see anyone just canceling that out.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 17:09:31 GMT
I'm certain it's the horns(?) that allow you to brace, less so the stirrups. M.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 18:07:45 GMT
Meant to add, it seems Brenno and I have similar taste in female body types...I prefer the Rubenesque model myself. But with less gut.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 20:09:00 GMT
I know the roman cavalry didn't use stirrups, they only had a saddle with four horns. These horns kept them from falling when swinging a sword and a shield. So even without stirrups a trained rider is perfectly capable of fighting.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 23:29:41 GMT
thanks paladin, then we look else where... i was thinking, i know im new at this and shouldnt do that lol, but i was thinking about having a blade blank cut from steel, grinding it down for the look, then molding and carving out the fittings to get the look.. not for real world, more to test my skills and hone them for the future.... since Ronin Katana has taken care of me in a few matter i am looking to build up a few ideas in the sword world...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2009 23:46:43 GMT
@fallen, yes, I have ridden a horse before. It's been awhile, but I used to be pretty good. Both with and without tack. Jumping, cross country and Jr. Steeple Chase. And since I was a kid, I played swordfighting with sticks with my sisters from horseback (my little brother was too little). The stirrup DOES make mounted fighting easier. But is not necessary with the sole exception of the lance. m. Eversberg II, try to brace in that saddle without stirrups for a lance charge and you'll break your back. You're talking about a head-on collision at 30+ mph (for each side if it's cavalry vs cavalry) in something that weighs about as much as your average American sedan. And the entire impact is channelling through your body. No air-bag. No seat-belt. No crumple zone. Just you. @cheness. Absolutely correct. The Mongols, too. No stirrups and only elementary saddles for that race of horse warriors. Come to think of it, the American Indian did pretty well fighting from horseback -- axe, spear, club, bow and rifle -- without stirrups, too. Again, the ONLY style of mounted combat that Requires stirrups, is the lance. All of the others are Helped by it. But only the Lance requires it. Every army that had stirrups used lancers. Throughout all of history. Stirrups means lancers. No lancers means no stirrups (sole exception being the US Cavalry, we never had lancers).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2009 6:24:35 GMT
Taran, look up Celtic stirrups grave find, pree BC, the celts allso had roller bearings for the wheels on their chariots! Some times tech gets lost and not passed down to improve later armys....SanMarc.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2009 12:49:02 GMT
Irish, that's not a bad idea...that's how a good many swords get made (albeit they get tempered as well so it isn't just a crowbar)- if you do go for it, keep us posted.
I'll keep an eye out but that is one movie sword that I have not heard anyone making.
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