Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 0:06:25 GMT
Can I put up my two cents ......... *takes cover under fortified bunker* Cold Napalm: Man you really love a good blog duel dont ya (although with slayerofdarkness its alright) .... Yeah fair enough more whip and flex blades good for training ........ totally ....... but I imagine Eyal supports alot of local Canadian cutters and fighters who have a tad bit of trouble getting other brands of swords into their homeland dont they ? so maybe DSA is their most practical option ....... and hey give the man dutifully running a small business providing to an international clientele as frankly a reasonable price (for something I intend to give my grandson in top notch fighting order) some cred. kidcasa: Yeah "in that price range" ....... Well the running consistency of eyals stuff is quite good, yeah a little heavier then usual (but hey shove his blade into a a pre-ren swordsmans or dark age vikings hands and they would probably hum with delight) but hey durability yes ....... a starting geometry for dedicated cutting would be good but do canadians have trouble on the export with that thing, maybe not .......... I hear mixed messages on that. I like the DSA "interpretation" on historical originals, gives some variety ........ Its like the CAS "Tinker" Viking Sharp, I asked Michael why didnt he have the point a little stubbier like historicals, he replied cause everyone does it and thats a truth in itself, variety sells itself. Hey the peening, thinner edges and lovely choice in leathers are a good step up considering the prices havent shifted much. Eyal: Hey you could shut them all up and do a Hanwei, sharps and blunts sold seperately, different strokes, different folks ....... then again consider price (and I imagine the extra workload on you and your smiths). End of the day I love having a DSA made in canada ........ I have to I'm aussie that blade travelled farther then I have in my life to get to me *TAKE COVER!!!!! INCOMING!!!!* Hee Hee ... I only have issue with one thing you said.... opinions of DSA being relative and all.... (what I mean is here they are popular, SFI they are snubbed, I don't own one so I'll hold an opinion until one happens my way...) ... its this silly notion everyone (not just you) seems to have that if you took a modern, low end , dirt cheap bare bones sword and gave it to a historic warrior that they would be quite pleased... I seriously doubt that... I see it said all the time about DSA, Gen 2 , Cheness etc.... it really makes me laugh.. many of these ancient warriors depended on their sword for life and a living, and spent huge amounts of money on them... for instance, a poor Samurai who could not afford a good blade would sell his home and all he had and send his family away to live... all to obtain a worthy blade... In Viking times there were swordsmiths whose wares were so prized and valuable that they were counterfeited... Even the best of the swords made today are only striving to meet the historical ideal... some meet , very few exceed it...certainly not sub $300 swords. DSA swords maybe nice enough ...I won't know unless they chose to send me one to review...but I wouldn't go so far as to compare them to the weapons of the old warriors.... Sure , I'm aware there were munitions grade swords back then... but those weren't the ones that replicas are being made of then aree they? Its all good, and its all in fun.... and this isn't really directed at you... I've just seen that said the required number of times lately to spur a rant.... sorry
|
|
|
Post by enkidu on Jan 8, 2009 0:23:04 GMT
The exact same pattern repeat itself... Cold Napalm jumps at each occasion he has to pick on Eyal, Eyal being picked on for the hundred time by the same person takes it personal and then it escalate to a ''discussion '' where who is wrong and who is right becomes totally irrevelant.
Its bad for both of you guys. Cold Napalm it undermines your reputation as one of the most important information source we have here at SBG giving us the impression of being a lot more subjective than objective. Weight your words, they are meaningful to many here and consequently have much repercussion.
Eyal, You take pride in your work and being constantly criticize on it takes a toll on you, but this whole thing makes unwanted bad publicity for you and your company right in your target audience nest.
And its bad for the whole forum. The main reason i post here and not in the two other major forums is because its generally way more civil in here, dont break up with this tradition.
|
|
SlayerofDarkness
Member
Review Points: 65
"Always give everyone the benefit of the doubt."
Posts: 3,067
|
Post by SlayerofDarkness on Jan 8, 2009 1:11:53 GMT
I couldn't have said it better myself, Enkidu! (and believe me, I tried! ) +1 Brissybeater: Why do you think that I 'need to be sorted out'? And as far as I know, Napalm and I have never gotten in an argument; maybe a bit of friendly 'verbal jousting', but no arguing. Did I do something wrong?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 1:12:44 GMT
Marc: Yeah here here mark agreed, ALTHOUGH its a funny comparison, would any of us need to sell big to get a reliable (usuable) sword now ........ although different times and economics suppose we could go in circles with it but your right indeed.
Enkidu: Well said, suppose thats the nice thing about SBG is the civility level and trying to kill off the elitest facate
|
|
|
Post by ShooterMike on Jan 8, 2009 1:18:17 GMT
My suggestion is Cold and Eyal have a beer together and sort it out. Too bad geography is prohibiting that. Hee Hee ... I only have issue with one thing you said.... ... its this silly notion everyone (not just you) seems to have that if you took a modern, low end , dirt cheap bare bones sword and gave it to a historic warrior that they would be quite pleased... I seriously doubt that... I see it said all the time about DSA, Gen 2 , Cheness etc.... it really makes me laugh.. many of these ancient warriors depended on their sword for life and a living, and spent huge amounts of money on them... for instance, a poor Samurai who could not afford a good blade would sell his home and all he had and send his family away to live... all to obtain a worthy blade... In Viking times there were swordsmiths whose wares were so prized and valuable that they were counterfeited... Even the best of the swords made today are only striving to meet the historical ideal... some meet , very few exceed it...certainly not sub $300 swords. DSA swords maybe nice enough ...I won't know unless they chose to send me one to review...but I wouldn't go so far as to compare them to the weapons of the old warriors.... Sure , I'm aware there were munitions grade swords back then... but those weren't the ones that replicas are being made of then aree they? Its all good, and its all in fun.... and this isn't really directed at you... I've just seen that said the required number of times lately to spur a rant.... sorry I can't help but chime in on this one too, as it's a particular area of study and passion of mine. It's my opinion that, not withstanding the homogeneous steel and outstanding heat treat, most of Albion's Next Gen line and most of Arms&Armor's medieval line... get ready... ARE MUNITIONS GRADE medieval swords, not the cream of the crop. Furthermore, I believe that almost any sub$300 sword, taken through a time machine to 1250-1500 and given to a knight, would be the equivalent of someone handing me a 25th century reproduction of a Ruger P85 (for those of you who are unfamiliar with this ungainly God-awful handgun, substitute anything that is substandard and undesirable) and gauging my reaction. Well made swords made "back in the day" were marvels of ergonomics and quick handling. We only really near them at the high end of production swords today. For a further example of this, ask anyone here who collects good military sabers from the 1700s and 1800s. They will tell you that you simply can't buy a sub$300 reproduction saber that handles anywhere near as well as an original that was mass-produced and issued to privates on the battlefield, let alone sabers that were custom made for officers. ...sorry for the rant. But the whole topic for me... is like stroking a cat's fur the wrong way.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 1:45:34 GMT
For a samurai even a Yoshido Yoshihara would probably be considered a worthy blade but the lower end of the worthy blades, again it would not be considered creme de la creme. (Apologies for my french )
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 1:51:06 GMT
I kind of disagree ....
In Japan they have an unbroken sword tradition, so not as much was lost.... might not be a Masamune, but still a notable blade .... the Japanese judge all blades past and present...Yoshihara's stuff ranks up there with past "especially worthy "or especially important" works
|
|
SlayerofDarkness
Member
Review Points: 65
"Always give everyone the benefit of the doubt."
Posts: 3,067
|
Post by SlayerofDarkness on Jan 8, 2009 1:55:28 GMT
Hey Marc? Do YOU know why Brissybeater was mad at me? I'm quite puzzled myself, lol.
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 2:00:33 GMT
Didn't know he was... don't sweat it.. its the web...we all just debate on here ... noone holds grudges
if someone gets mad theyll get over it
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 2:01:37 GMT
Marc: Whilst it may be true, I think that it is safe to say that every hundred years or so there is some degradation of information because if there wasn't then the living treasures would still be turning out Masamune quality blades. Then again I have never seen a Yoshihara let alone handled one so I may be completely off.
How do they judge past blades? Do they still have examples of the Master Smiths of the past?
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 2:04:46 GMT
Marc: Whilst it may be true, I think that it is safe to say that every hundred years or so there is some degradation of information because if there wasn't then the living treasures would still be turning out Masamune quality blades. Then again I have never seen a Yoshihara let alone handled one so I may be completely off. How do they judge past blades? Do they still have examples of the Master Smiths of the past? Obviously they don't have all the blades but thousands and thousand survive.... And I agree there are periods where there is some degredation... like the edo period... in the shin-shinto they were trying to get back to the glory days of koto... so sure , there are "black" periods.... Talent means a lot too...
|
|
|
Post by kidcasanova on Jan 8, 2009 2:07:35 GMT
If it bothers you, just PM him and politely ask him what he meant. We didn't get a mass PM about why Brissy said that. Eyal, I'm glad you arent offended by my criticism. I agree with some of the other ideas like forging with a cutting geometry, and you've already tackled peening your pommels so no worries there. ;D I'm not worried so much about a strictly historical piece, as long as it handles and cuts like one. I rather enjoy many interpretations of those pieces. And if you did an arming sword with the Ranger cross and a scent stopper pommel that handled well and weighed about the same as the Knight or less and with more distal taper and a thinner geometry, I would snatch it up in a heartbeat, friend.
|
|
SlayerofDarkness
Member
Review Points: 65
"Always give everyone the benefit of the doubt."
Posts: 3,067
|
Post by SlayerofDarkness on Jan 8, 2009 2:10:59 GMT
It's ok, Marc, I just like to resolve things becuase I prefer to not have people upset, you know?
What I was talking about is this, you can find it near the bottom of page 3... Brissybeater responding to ColdNapalm: 'Cold Napalm: Man you really love a good blog duel dont ya (although with slayerofdarkness its alright, he needs to be sorted out) ....'
I'm just wondering why he said that. As far as I know,I haven't even been in an argument with ColdNapalm, lol.
Thanks, Slayer
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 2:11:42 GMT
My suggestion is Cold and Eyal have a beer together and sort it out. Too bad geography is prohibiting that. Hee Hee ... I only have issue with one thing you said.... ... its this silly notion everyone (not just you) seems to have that if you took a modern, low end , dirt cheap bare bones sword and gave it to a historic warrior that they would be quite pleased... I seriously doubt that... I see it said all the time about DSA, Gen 2 , Cheness etc.... it really makes me laugh.. many of these ancient warriors depended on their sword for life and a living, and spent huge amounts of money on them... for instance, a poor Samurai who could not afford a good blade would sell his home and all he had and send his family away to live... all to obtain a worthy blade... In Viking times there were swordsmiths whose wares were so prized and valuable that they were counterfeited... Even the best of the swords made today are only striving to meet the historical ideal... some meet , very few exceed it...certainly not sub $300 swords. DSA swords maybe nice enough ...I won't know unless they chose to send me one to review...but I wouldn't go so far as to compare them to the weapons of the old warriors.... Sure , I'm aware there were munitions grade swords back then... but those weren't the ones that replicas are being made of then aree they? Its all good, and its all in fun.... and this isn't really directed at you... I've just seen that said the required number of times lately to spur a rant.... sorry I can't help but chime in on this one too, as it's a particular area of study and passion of mine. It's my opinion that, not withstanding the homogeneous steel and outstanding heat treat, most of Albion's Next Gen line and most of Arms&Armor's medieval line... get ready... ARE MUNITIONS GRADE medieval swords, not the cream of the crop. Furthermore, I believe that almost any sub$300 sword, taken through a time machine to 1250-1500 and given to a knight, would be the equivalent of someone handing me a 25th century reproduction of a Ruger P85 (for those of you who are unfamiliar with this ungainly God-awful handgun, substitute anything that is substandard and undesirable) and gauging my reaction. Well made swords made "back in the day" were marvels of ergonomics and quick handling. We only really near them at the high end of production swords today. For a further example of this, ask anyone here who collects good military sabers from the 1700s and 1800s. They will tell you that you simply can't buy a sub$300 reproduction saber that handles anywhere near as well as an original that was mass-produced and issued to privates on the battlefield, let alone sabers that were custom made for officers. ...sorry for the rant. But the whole topic for me... is like stroking a cat's fur the wrong way. Yep , hear hear, wot wot and well said pip pip
|
|
|
Post by kidcasanova on Jan 8, 2009 2:13:49 GMT
It's ok, Marc, I just like to resolve things becuase I prefer to not have people upset, you know? What I was talking about is this, you can find it near the bottom of page 3... Brissybeater responding to ColdNapalm: 'Cold Napalm: Man you really love a good blog duel dont ya (although with slayerofdarkness its alright, he needs to be sorted out) ....' I'm just wondering why he said that. As far as I know,I haven't even been in an argument with ColdNapalm, lol. Thanks, Slayer Just PM him.
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 2:15:39 GMT
It's ok, Marc, I just like to resolve things becuase I prefer to not have people upset, you know? What I was talking about is this, you can find it near the bottom of page 3... Brissybeater responding to ColdNapalm: 'Cold Napalm: Man you really love a good blog duel dont ya (although with slayerofdarkness its alright, he needs to be sorted out) ....' I'm just wondering why he said that. As far as I know,I haven't even been in an argument with ColdNapalm, lol. Thanks, Slayer Yea I saw it...wouldn't let it bother me... its all good... Hey, at least hes thinking about you ... Look Slayer , I have arguments and people get pissed at me here ALL THE TIME... right BW;) Its really no big deal
|
|
SlayerofDarkness
Member
Review Points: 65
"Always give everyone the benefit of the doubt."
Posts: 3,067
|
Post by SlayerofDarkness on Jan 8, 2009 2:16:12 GMT
Why didn't I think of that? Thanks, kidcasa, I MUST be tired, lol.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 3:09:40 GMT
Was that rhetorical?
|
|
Marc Ridgeway
Member
Retired Global Moderator
"The best cost less when you buy it the first time." - Papabear
Posts: 3,122
|
Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jan 8, 2009 3:16:30 GMT
Was that rhetorical? Yeah... I was just saying I've ruffled some feathers , and had some spats , but it all works out.....
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 4:05:05 GMT
Enkidu, I wouldn't say all of the blows up me and Eyal has had has resulted in what you describe as a "discussion" where the end results didn't matter. The historical accuracy discussion ended up in a rather fruitful thread with a lot of good information in it I thought. And if you recall, that was started when Eyal accused that I had no knowledge of history and was unfit to judge his blades in that manner. The anduril thread with the mystery metal also had good info in it as well...and that started when Eyal accused Steve of lying (I really was not an instigator of this one at all...just like the science part...see the geek thread hehe). Although, yes it seems we are getting to a point that we are fighting for fighting sake in this thread. And I'm not sure where even the disagreement is really. But his tone has gotten worse since the myarmoury incident...I guess I can try and be more civil. But honestly, No promises. And considering how much has happened you'd think I'd hate the man...but I still think he is a nice guy who treats his customers very well. That goes a very long way in my book...despite all the blow up we have with each other .
|
|