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Post by mrstabby on May 1, 2023 8:26:09 GMT
I have 2 problem children, a Hanwei Oxtai Dao (1566 steel, brushed look) and a cheap Han Jian (1045, mirror polish). When I oil them, the oil forms droplets and does not create a smooth film on them, and I don't know why. I have cleaned them with acetone, tried different oils, everything just forms little drops. Oils I tried: Japanese clove sword oil, mineral oil, sewing machine oil (I use primarily this for my swords since it does not smell and I can get it everywhere), silicon oil, Ballistol USTA and WD40. I can't use gun oil because of the brass fittings. Has anyone had this problem? How to solve it? I have bought some renaissance wax, but it takes a while to get here.
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on May 1, 2023 13:35:47 GMT
Believe it or not, you want the oil to be so thin you don't see it. Wanna test? Oil up a blade as you have.... Wash any oil off your fingers and wipe the blade with toilet paper...you'll see your oil and any gunk.
An even better test... Oil it and sprinkle cat hair on it....let me tell ya...it'll stick.
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Post by mrstabby on May 1, 2023 14:50:27 GMT
The problem is, the blades rust where the oil pulls off. It looks like water on a window. Like there is something driving off the oil. Its bone dry there, no oil at all. The pics are around 200x. On the first you can see drops of oil on the Oxtail blade, the second are specs of dust immersed in the oil film on one of my other swords (as it should be to protect effectively from rust). Attachments:
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on May 1, 2023 14:59:32 GMT
I use petrol jelly/vaseline, a soaked rags for a thinner layer or directly greased for a thicker layer. Less liquid than oil and cheaper than Ren wax, and good for skin and leather. After some time the more liquid components evaporate and a more waxy layer remains
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Post by mrstabby on May 1, 2023 16:00:53 GMT
I use petrol jelly/vaseline, a soaked rags for a thinner layer or directly greased for a thicker layer. Less liquid than oil and cheaper than Ren wax, and good for skin and leather. After some time the more liquid components evaporate and a more waxy layer remains How often do you refresh the vaseline? I use something my wife bought for makeup to apply the oil, "lint free zeletten". They aren't very absorbtive and pretty strong. They are hard to cut, which gives me a bit of added safety around the edges, and they leave a nice film on objects without absorbing much oil like rags do. I will try the vaseline, worst case I'll wash it off with some acetone.
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on May 1, 2023 16:06:51 GMT
After some months, or even longer. I don't cut with my blades and the climate here is not rust conducive.
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Ouroboros
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Post by Ouroboros on May 1, 2023 17:55:18 GMT
Believe it or not, you want the oil to be so thin you don't see it. Wanna test? Oil up a blade as you have.... Wash any oil off your fingers and wipe the blade with toilet paper...you'll see your oil and any gunk. An even better test... Oil it and sprinkle cat hair on it....let me tell ya...it'll stick. Please to seperate hair from cat first lest blade do that for u. Is it possible that they have been renwaxed or otherwise protected (by dark arts arcane) by a previous owner?
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Post by mrstabby on May 1, 2023 19:06:58 GMT
Only possible thing would be something that is neiter soluble in oil or acetone. I might have to try washing it with dish soap. I bought it directly from a shop, should not be a previous owner, and it did not look "used". The shop owner might have put something on it though.
If you do not separate the hair from the cat first, you might find yourself in a knifefight...
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 2, 2023 0:47:29 GMT
You might try other solvents such as alcohol and/or ether. If that fails try waxing, a car paste wax is cheaper than ren wax and from that stand point be better for a trial. Andi’s suggestion is good. I’ve heard of Vaseline being used but never used it.
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LeMal
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Post by LeMal on May 2, 2023 3:29:21 GMT
Hmm. Could be a wax. Besides ether you could try benzene or hexane. If those aren't handy, paint stripper, paint thinner and/or--good ol' gasoline. (Carefully.)
Though I'd first actually try heating up some oil (vegetable, olive, whatever) and wiping it on, then soap & water.
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Post by mrstabby on May 2, 2023 7:03:06 GMT
Honestly if acetone can not take something off, alcohol, ether or gasoline don't have a chance. Acetone is the one of strongest solvents out there. Hexane could work though, since its apolar and can dissolove things, that acetone can't. I'd have to buy some first. I will go with brush, soap and water first. I use isopropanol to clean the swords after use and if its extremely stubborn or I need to remove everything acetone. Thats why I am so weirded out by this, the blade should not have anything on it. But I'll wash it and try again, else I try hexane.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 2, 2023 12:23:07 GMT
Honestly if acetone can not take something off, alcohol, ether or gasoline don't have a chance. Acetone is the one of strongest solvents out there. With that view point, try water; it’s an universal solvent being capable dissolving more things. However, …
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on May 2, 2023 13:58:33 GMT
Or....sand the blade and see if that makes a difference
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Post by mrstabby on May 2, 2023 15:58:15 GMT
Crap. Washed it with brush, sponge and soap, dried it with i-propanol and wiped it with acetone, even sanded it because I made some scratches when sharpening, but it still repels the oil. So, its vaseline next. Might even glide through bottles better Its a mystery to me, why these two swords do it.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 2, 2023 20:06:29 GMT
Another solution is to forget the oil and switch to wax. While waiting for your ren wax to arrive try a car paste wax. As it would be fast and not expensive, giving you some idea of what to expect.
You were asking about various solvents; one I didn’t see thrown out was WD-40. It’s a surprisingly good solvent that many people aren’t aware of. And is what I use to remove wax from my blades. You need to rub before the vehicle evaporates.
One final thought, possibly you are just not holding your mouth right?
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Post by mrstabby on May 3, 2023 20:03:30 GMT
Another solution is to forget the oil and switch to wax. While waiting for your ren wax to arrive try a car paste wax. As it would be fast and not expensive, giving you some idea of what to expect. You were asking about various solvents; one I didn’t see thrown out was WD-40. It’s a surprisingly good solvent that many people aren’t aware of. And is what I use to remove wax from my blades. You need to rub before the vehicle evaporates. One final thought, possibly you are just not holding your mouth right? Any specific car wax I should look for?
WD40 acts much like hexane. Thanks, should save me from having to buy hexane. I do not like using it, haven't had much luck using it beyound specific cases (it works well for loosening rustet bolts) but it does not protect well against rust and it disappears quickly from things that need lubrication in my experience. There are some things in the WD40 that make it good for taking off stubborn waxy stuff but it evaporates quickly, like you said, I'll try scrubbing the blade with this. But I can't imaginge anything being left on the blade now after so many washings with other harsh chemicals.
"One final thought, possibly you are just not holding your mouth right?" Sorry, but what do you mean by that?
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 3, 2023 20:55:41 GMT
I use Turtle paste wax. Mainly because of its availability. In other words, it’s the only brand sold at the market. Have you contacted the original owners of the swords to inquire what they may have put on? Possibly it’s down in the grain and merely rubbing the surface will have little to no effect. Do not confuse the vehicle evaporating after applying WD-40 to that of WD-40 vanishing. Here are 2.,000 uses for WD-40: files.wd40.com/pdf/WD-40_Multi_Use_Product_2000_Uses_final.pdf As for your mouth, I think some of the more elderly members here understand. As for you, ask your mom. It’s an expression I learned in the US.
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Post by mrstabby on May 4, 2023 7:21:06 GMT
Has anyone here ever used natural wax? I have a big bag of clean carnauba wax somewhere. The same stuff seems to be in car wax. I know you should be careful with it for longtime storage, since it can go bad, I am just asking. They did use it in the past like this, right? Warm it up until liquid and brush it on the weapon/armor. No haven´t contacted the seller, he is not helpful with problems (not a private person but a "real" shop). Believe me. He sells you defective stuff and argues for weeks over taking it back, then tells you you did something to it. Never buying there again. Not talking to him either. I haven´t confused the solvent evaporating, no. Most of its cleaning properties go away quickly. I wouldn´t believe the ads from the manufacturer that much honestly, I have used it as rust preventer, but it never worked as well as most other oils. Its more a short term solution. The bicycle repair guys around here always tell you not to use it on chains every occasion they can, because it doesn´t protect well. They also hate Ballistol since its water soluable and gets washed off quickly. If there is no water Ballistol works well, but on this sword it would surely damage the fittings. EDIT: I just found out WD40 is different in the US! Might work completely differently where the US or Australian versions are sold! This is really weird. There are no components that hold on for a long time in the version sold around the EU, this version really seems only fit for cleaning.
As for the saying, I am not in the US. Now that I know its an Idiom I googeled it. Never ever heard this before. Seems to be quite a place specific phrase.
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Post by MOK on May 4, 2023 9:08:58 GMT
]EDIT: I just found out WD40 is different in the US! Might work completely differently where the US or Australian versions are sold! This is really weird. There are no components that hold on for a long time in the version sold around the EU, this version really seems only fit for cleaning. As for the saying, I am not in the US. Now that I know its an Idiom I googeled it. Never ever heard this before. Seems to be quite a place specific phrase. WD-40 actually markets a bunch of different things, including several subtly different varieties of their eponymous flagship product.
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on May 4, 2023 13:46:50 GMT
Natural wax can work. I've got friends that have spring tempered steel armor that use carnuba and beeswax, and swear by it. It seems to work very well. Plus, it sounds like you've got one like I do...it rusts if you look at it funny. That one I clean with windex then ren-wax. It works about 1/3rd as well compared to the other swords. So 6 months for most, 2 months for the problem child.
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