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Post by ring61 on May 21, 2022 18:25:26 GMT
Hello
I'm going to buy a swiss 1867 sabre for solo cutting drills. I can choose between a troopers and an infantry officers one (pipeback).
I prefer the look of the troopers sabre but is it nimble enough or too heavy? Is the the pipeback better suited for this job?
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Post by pellius on May 21, 2022 18:40:50 GMT
Greetings, and welcome to the forum.
You may well know all this, but since you asked for opinions:
The Swiss swords are a great choice. They are some of my very favorites.
The 1867 trooper is a cavalry saber, and is a serious bruiser of a sword. It handles nicely - for a cav saber.
The dismounted officer saber is beautiful but dainty, with a piquette / parade disposition.
So I would guess which works best depends on what drills you wish to do and what you like in a sword.
You might also consider the Swiss 1896 cav trooper, which is still a serious fighter, but leans toward infantry proportions, despite its designation.
If you can find one, the 1867 mounted officer (with a fullered blade) is by far the best of them all.
jmtc
Edit Sorry. I reread your post and realized you have two to choose from. Of the two, I would go with the 67 trooper. Not as pretty, but quite a bit more serious.
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Post by pellius on May 21, 2022 18:51:05 GMT
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Post by ring61 on May 21, 2022 19:36:25 GMT
Thank you for your answer. I think I will buy the troopers one. I have also found an interesting table that shows the specs of the swiss sabres.
The fullered cavalry officers sabre is only 52 grams heavier than the pipeback but it's also longer.
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Post by pellius on May 21, 2022 20:00:07 GMT
That table was created by Markus, and is from the second thread I listed.
Anyway, I think you’ll like your ‘67 trooper.
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Post by pellius on May 22, 2022 3:24:54 GMT
… The fullered cavalry officers sabre is only 52 grams heavier than the pipeback but it's also longer.
I am fortunate enough to own both of those particular swords. Got ‘em from Markus long ago. Imho, the fullered saber is far superior. The pipeback might be faster, but the saber has much better blade presence.
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Post by jimmythedonut on May 22, 2022 22:32:35 GMT
The troopers/officers mounted 1867 is, in my opinion, the finest iteration of the Austrian/Anglo (Wilkinson) style cut and thrust blade ever made. Ignoring my own feelings on the weighting of the officers version (a bit too neutral in my hand, though I've 2 other examples somewhere in Germany I am waiting to get sent over here assuming my contact doesn't commit international theft to a monetary amount large enough I can have him prosecuted), the lines and proportions and angles are just superb. The troopers version is an absolute beast. In the hands of some 6'5 trooper properly trained it would be terrifying if used at the speed lighter sabres can be used with.
Congrats on your sword, but I am sorry. Because now that you have felt the quality of Swiss swords, very few others will live up to the quality!
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Post by ring61 on May 23, 2022 19:29:51 GMT
The troopers/officers mounted 1867 is, in my opinion, the finest iteration of the Austrian/Anglo (Wilkinson) style cut and thrust blade ever made. Ignoring my own feelings on the weighting of the officers version (a bit too neutral in my hand, though I've 2 other examples somewhere in Germany I am waiting to get sent over here assuming my contact doesn't commit international theft to a monetary amount large enough I can have him prosecuted), the lines and proportions and angles are just superb. The troopers version is an absolute beast. In the hands of some 6'5 trooper properly trained it would be terrifying if used at the speed lighter sabres can be used with. Congrats on your sword, but I am sorry. Because now that you have felt the quality of Swiss swords, very few others will live up to the quality! So you think it could reach the speed of an average infantry sabre it the person handling it is properly trained and strong enough?
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Post by jimmythedonut on May 23, 2022 19:34:36 GMT
The troopers/officers mounted 1867 is, in my opinion, the finest iteration of the Austrian/Anglo (Wilkinson) style cut and thrust blade ever made. Ignoring my own feelings on the weighting of the officers version (a bit too neutral in my hand, though I've 2 other examples somewhere in Germany I am waiting to get sent over here assuming my contact doesn't commit international theft to a monetary amount large enough I can have him prosecuted), the lines and proportions and angles are just superb. The troopers version is an absolute beast. In the hands of some 6'5 trooper properly trained it would be terrifying if used at the speed lighter sabres can be used with. Congrats on your sword, but I am sorry. Because now that you have felt the quality of Swiss swords, very few others will live up to the quality! So you think it could reach the speed of an average infantry sabre it the person handling it is properly trained and strong enough? I think it's entirely likely. Here's an article on the average height of Swiss conscripts from the late 1800s onward. (https://smw.ch/article/doi/smw.2011.13238) On the assumption that there was a similar increase in height then we can assume the average height was a bit shorter in the mid-late 1800s. Conversely if we look at countries like Sweden who had absolute giants for the Swedish Dragoons (who used a 37" long sword with the 1893 model) then it stands to reason that someone of that size who is used to using a large sword probably has an easier time maneuvering it around, though technique does still matter too. Far too heavy for the Roworth/British style of cutting with the wrist, probably closer to the Berliner Turnschule or even the Radaellian system used in Italy, albeit the 1867 troopers is about as far weight wise from those dainty 1855 Infantry Officer's Sabres as you can get
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Post by snubnoze on May 24, 2022 0:53:57 GMT
Between those two the 67 Trooper for sure. As noted the pipe back, while a very nice sword, is pretty dainty. The 67 mounted officer is a nice middle ground but pretty difficult to find. I finally got one and it was a regrettable purchase due to it having a pretty shotty restoration and bent blade. Paid too much for it, oh well. You may also like the 1896 Trooper it's smaller than the 67 and easier/cheaper to find. I do think the 67 while bigger handles better tho, I prefer the shape of the handle more.
But ya I agree with the other opinions, the 1867 Trooper is the best Swiss sword, although I miss the pretty honeysuckle guard on it.
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