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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 21, 2022 2:42:00 GMT
I recently decided to polish my Katana using the sanding method tutorial on the forum, when I did, there were tons of ugly little lines (probably sandpaper scratches) which mess up the look of the sword. Is there any way that I can remove these scratches?
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Post by paulmuaddib on Feb 21, 2022 2:55:56 GMT
Keep going finer. I’ve done the same thing and that’s all I’ve figured out. Still working on some. You are taking steel off though.
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Post by pellius on Feb 21, 2022 3:22:57 GMT
I’m guessing you mean this thread: sbg-sword-forum.forums.net/thread/52806/antique-blades-pelliuss-cleaning-threadsIf not, just kinda ignore the rest of this. Very broadly speaking, military Euro sabers were historically polished to the equivalent of about 400 grit, with troopers even using sand to field polish their blades. I’ve actually decreased the level of polish on some of my Euro’s to make them a bit more acceptable to the collector crowd. On the other hand, the polish standard for katana generally seems to be “optical grade mirror.” You can definitely get that with sandpaper, but it will be an absolute ton of work. The higher grits, say 1000+, foul very quickly, so it will also take a lot of sandpaper. The katana crowd generally frowns on using sandpaper to clean katana, especially old nihonto. They seem to recommend high end professional stone polishing or nothing. Stone polishing runs maybe a couple grand and a year wait in my neck of the woods. Higher grit paper will certainly help your scratches, though you may want to use a different technique than the rolled up paper strip method. I once saw a tutorial where a guy glued large sheets of sandpaper to a glass sheet, though I never tried such a thing. It will be tough to get back to a mirror finish with sandpaper. If you hive it a go, please share your project with the forum!
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 21, 2022 3:42:51 GMT
My sword is relatively cheap, that’s why I chose this method. In addition, I heard that fine grit sandpaper was a safer alternative to using a stone, and the cost of a professional polishing job is worth more than the sword itself.
Thank you for the advice, I also heard that stropping might help solve my problem, but I’m not sure if a leather strop would be harsh enough to remove the scratches as I have only seen the method used for sharpening. Could that be another alternative?
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Post by pellius on Feb 21, 2022 13:49:00 GMT
Honestly, I don’t think stropping will help much.
Perhaps a useful middle ground would be using metal polish such as Mothers Mag. It doesn’t remove much metal, but may soften the appearance of the scratches. Just a thought.
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Post by RickDastardly on Feb 21, 2022 14:15:39 GMT
If you want to go for that mirror finish, look into lapping film, or micro mesh.
I occasionally use 3M brand diamond lapping film for a final mirror polish sharpening on knives. Micro mesh is commonly used too, in the knife world, for finishing polish on the blades although I've never used it myself.
Both go down to really fine grades (sub micron for lapping film)
Alternatively, diamond paste on a leather or cloth back (even cut up jeans will do, or microfibre cloth). I've done that too.
Whatever you use, cleanliness is the key to preventing additional scratches. Never let your finer abrasives be contaminated by left over grit from the previous, courser polishing.
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 21, 2022 17:50:15 GMT
I used some rolite metal polish paste that I purchased on amazon, It gave me a mirror finish which was nice, but there were still all of those tiny sandpaper lines in the sword that made it look ugly. Today I am going to try rolling up super fine grit sandpaper (1000-1200) to remove the scratches. Fingers crossed that it works. The polish paste I used: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075T2XCH4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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steveboy
Member
Measure twice, cut once.
Posts: 367
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Post by steveboy on Feb 22, 2022 0:34:06 GMT
I used some rolite metal polish paste that I purchased on amazon, It gave me a mirror finish which was nice, but there were still all of those tiny sandpaper lines in the sword that made it look ugly. Today I am going to try rolling up super fine grit sandpaper (1000-1200) to remove the scratches. Fingers crossed that it works. The polish paste I used: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075T2XCH4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1FWIW, when I do a "tuneup" on someone's ill-used katana, I generally work my way up to 2500 grit. Without pix it's hard to know what to say beyond some general guidelines, but if a blade is fairly scratched up I'll start with 400 and work my way up, usually to 800, 1200 or 1500, 2000, and 2500.
I use a palm sander and lubricate the sandpaper with pure vegetable oil, then finish with Peek or Metal Glo and finally Mother's.
If the hamon is fake, you'll lose it. (Well, if the hamon is real, you'll probably mostly lose it, too.) Not sure there's any way around that if you want substantial scratches gone. If the scratches are too deep, it ain't worth doing, as getting rid of them really means sanding down the katana to the lowest level of the lowest scratch. On lower-end blades, this often means exposing alloyed metals you don't necessarily want to see. (I went into some detail on this customization walk-through -- and you can definitely see where I started to reach a point of diminishing returns.)
A pic would help!
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 22, 2022 3:15:49 GMT
The sword is deferentially hardened and therefore does have a real hamon line, however it is very subtle. I plan on acid etching it if/when I can shake this small scratch issue. I do not believe any of the scratches are deep in the blade, but then again, I'm no professional when it comes to sword polishing. I The lighting makes it difficult to see what I am talking about, but here are a few images of the scratches:
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steveboy
Member
Measure twice, cut once.
Posts: 367
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Post by steveboy on Feb 22, 2022 4:11:07 GMT
From what I can see it doesn't look that bad. I wouldn't go more coarse than 800. But whatever grit you start at, you pretty much have to work your way up to very fine. I'd try 800, 1200, maybe 1500 (depending on how uniform it's starting to look), 2000, 2500, and then switch to polishes. And definitely use some kind of lubricant. Pure vegetable oil, mineral oil, 3-in-one ought to be fine. A lot of people recommend Flitz for polishing. I've never used it, but have had great success with Metal Glo, Peek, and Mother's Aluminum Polish.
Definitely read the opinions of others with DIY polishing experiences; there are lots of approaches to this stuff, and you should mine them for what you think works best for you.
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 23, 2022 3:34:18 GMT
Thank you all very much for the advice! I will be back with results in a few days
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 24, 2022 17:34:25 GMT
Alright, so I used sandpaper from 800-3000 grit over the course of a few hours and for the most part it worked very well, however, the lines are still quite visible and it doesn’t have the full mirror polish that the other side of the blade has. Any suggestions as to how I can find tune it?
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Post by paulmuaddib on Feb 24, 2022 18:00:21 GMT
Alright, so I used sandpaper from 800-3000 grit over the course of a few hours and for the most part it worked very well, however, the lines are still quite visible and it doesn’t have the full mirror polish that the other side of the blade has. Any suggestions as to how I can find tune it? I’ve had (still have) that same problem. I think I used too course of a sand paper in the beginning and then sped through the other grits more quickly than I should have. Sounds like your having the same problem. You may need to go all the way back to 400 and maybe spend more time on each grit. Maybe take two or three or even more evenings doing it. I haven’t had the chance to go back on mine that throughly yet but is what I need to do. Just need to find the time.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Feb 24, 2022 21:59:42 GMT
patience is the key to a good modern polish, imho. well, any polish I guess. you need to make sure you use the next higher grit until the lines from the last grit paper are gone. if you've moved up to the highest grit paper and still see lines, you've moved up too quickly and need to go back. start again with whatever grit is the next higher from the one that left the deepest scratches and polish until those deepest scratches are gone, then do the same for every higher grit.
the used sandpaper should be changed for fresh as soon as you don't feel the bite anymore, otherwise you're just wasting time and effort. you'll likely go through a LOT of paper for a full length blade polish. remember to try and keep your blade's geometry as crisp as possible by using a block/flat surface.
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Post by durinnmcfurren on Feb 25, 2022 22:03:15 GMT
Here's my experience with polishing steel using sandpaper. Though I've only done pommels and guards, not blades. So maybe this was more polishing iron than steel.
1. You have to make sure you really stay with each grit stage long enough. If you don't, you'll end up with mostly a mirror polish, but with some lines through it. And when you switch from 400 to 800 or other low grits, it's easy to overlook that you haven't fully evened things out to the next grit level!
2. You will use a ton of sandpaper, because that stuff fouls up almost immediately.
3. To get a proper mirror finish, I go up to 10000-15000 grit. It's available reasonably cheap on amazon.
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 26, 2022 0:54:37 GMT
Okay, at this point I have gotten rid of the lines and matched the grain to the other side of the sword, and the lines are virtually gone. However, I can’t seem to achieve a perfect “industrial grade mirror” polish, as the polish seems clouded or fuzzy (If that makes any sense). Any solutions to this or will I need to sand it down more to get the polish I want.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Feb 26, 2022 2:21:22 GMT
Okay, at this point I have gotten rid of the lines and matched the grain to the other side of the sword, and the lines are virtually gone. However, I can’t seem to achieve a perfect “industrial grade mirror” polish, as the polish seems clouded or fuzzy (If that makes any sense). Any solutions to this or will I need to sand it down more to get the polish I want. that could possibly be your technique. your strokes for most of the polishing would be at alternating angles while the last stages are usually lengthwise. make sure you're polishing with even pressure and as straight as possible, while also slightly lifting pressure near the end strokes, keeping them from swirling. swirling can make the polish look cloudy. not sure if you watched any vids yet but there are many good ones on yt. some for knives/shorter blades, which could still be helpful as far as materials used and technique. btw, if you're trying to replicate the look of the polish found on Japanese made blades, the only area that is "shiny" would be from the shinogi up to the mune. from the shinogi down, it's more of a light satin look. typically, the less expensive production katana would sport full mirror polishes. these pics illustrate what I mean.
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Post by ilikepasta on Feb 26, 2022 4:08:22 GMT
Okay, I think I will change the polish to a more satin finish on both sides, and then I will do some work to bring out my hamon line. Thank you all for the advice and help!
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Post by durinnmcfurren on Feb 26, 2022 16:11:01 GMT
Okay, at this point I have gotten rid of the lines and matched the grain to the other side of the sword, and the lines are virtually gone. However, I can’t seem to achieve a perfect “industrial grade mirror” polish, as the polish seems clouded or fuzzy (If that makes any sense). Any solutions to this or will I need to sand it down more to get the polish I want. Usually a cloudy mirror just means you need to go to a finer grit, I think?
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Post by stevengraham on Dec 7, 2023 18:43:42 GMT
Okay, at this point I have gotten rid of the lines and matched the grain to the other side of the sword, and the lines are virtually gone. However, I can’t seem to achieve a perfect “industrial grade mirror” polish, as the polish seems clouded or fuzzy (If that makes any sense). Any solutions to this or will I need to sand it down more to get the polish I want. that could possibly be your technique. your strokes for most of the polishing would be at alternating angles while the last stages are usually lengthwise. make sure you're polishing with even pressure and as straight as possible, while also slightly lifting pressure near the end strokes, keeping them from swirling. swirling can make the polish look cloudy. not sure if you watched any vids yet but there are many good ones on yt. some for knives/shorter blades, which could still be helpful as far as materials used and technique. btw, if you're trying to replicate the look of the polish found on Japanese made blades, the only area that is "shiny" would be from the shinogi up to the mune. from the shinogi down, it's more of a light satin look. typically, the less expensive production katana would sport full mirror polishes. these pics illustrate what I mean.
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