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Post by plasikaris on Jul 7, 2021 2:05:17 GMT
Hi. So lets say that these two katanas are at the same price. I would go for the wind and thunder katana because I want a strong "heavy" cutter katana but I really dont want to spend 900€ (thats the lowest price in europe) for a 1065 steel. Koi katana on the other hand has a T10 steel and a bigger tsuka (I prefer long tsukas in katanas) and the lowest price in europe is 950€. I like both of them but I prefer T10 steel. Any advice?
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Post by tancred on Jul 7, 2021 2:41:53 GMT
I have several Hanwei katana, but neither of these models. I wouldn't be too afraid of the 1065 steel being inferior in any way to the T10; Hanwei has consistently put out good cutters with their 1065. I'm not too sure about the exchange rate, but to my eye the price difference seems like the W+T might be cheaper here in the US--$220 cheaper than the Koi. Less price and almost (maybe) equal value/performance is a big factor, imo. Another factor is the tsuka length. You say you like longer tsuka, but what are you familiar and comfortable with? Stats at KOA show the Koi with a 15" tsuka. I don't have the Koi, but I do have the similar dimensioned Golden Oriole. I really like the Oriole, but with the tsuka that long, it does seem to get in the way sometimes. In a similar way, going by the stats of the W+T, its tsuka is less than 11" with an almost 30" blade. The overall sword weighs more than the Koi, as well. With that added weight and shorter tsuka, I almost worry the W+T might be poorly balanced. Just my personal preference, but I like my tsuka to be as close to 12" as possible. Anything less than 11" won't do it for me. However, 14" or higher is really pushing it for me (even though I do like my Oriole). Perhaps least important to some people is koshirae. It is an important factor to me, because I'm not skilled enough to customize my own. So, the W+T koshirae doesn't do anything for me. On the other other hand, the Koi koshirae looks really nice, imo. I also really like the white ito on black same. I suppose what it all boils down to is what is the most important factor for you? Price? W+T probably wins here. Looks? Koi, imo. Functionality/quality of steel? I'm guessing they're pretty equal. Or some other factor important to you? If price isn't a real factor, I'd go with the Koi. That's my vote. If you're like me, though, price is almost always a factor. I'd scour the Classifieds here. You might find a used one of either model at a great, bargain price. I don't think I've ever seen a Koi come up here, but there could have been some W+T. Whichever sword you go with, I hope you like it!
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Post by swordenthusiast on Jul 7, 2021 4:45:39 GMT
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Post by plasikaris on Jul 7, 2021 10:15:44 GMT
Thank you for your advice, well the price really doesnt matter cause in europe as I mentioned these two katanas are at the same price. And yes some sellers say that the W&T is a T10 but most of sellers list it as 1065.
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Post by swordenthusiast on Jul 7, 2021 20:22:19 GMT
I like the look of the W&T better, but I would be inclined to go with the T10. I would also be concerned about the dealers listing the W&T as 1065. Sounds like they may not know their steel.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jul 7, 2021 21:27:24 GMT
the W&T is listed as t10 on the CAS Iberia website. not sure how accurate the info is on the website you're looking at.
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Post by plasikaris on Jul 7, 2021 23:19:18 GMT
I know its listed as T10 but im really suspicious because if you look around some say just high carbon steel, others say T10 and others say 1065. I mean why would someone list a sword that is T10 as 1065? I dont know I did some searching and it should be T10 because the most legit and famous sellers have it as T10 but I still dont get it why so many sellers have it as 1065.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jul 8, 2021 3:09:35 GMT
I know its listed as T10 but im really suspicious because if you look around some say just high carbon steel, others say T10 and others say 1065. I mean why would someone list a sword that is T10 as 1065? I dont know I did some searching and it should be T10 because the most legit and famous sellers have it as T10 but I still dont get it why so many sellers have it as 1065. not sure why. I think some of their blades used to be made from different steel, including Manchurian rail steel, HSW1&2 (or something like that), Swedish powdered steel and maybe also 1065 or similar, maybe some sellers have some really old stock left or maybe just haven't changed their ad copy since they changed the steel type, or maybe they just simply made a mistake. the fire changed some stuff and then like I said earlier, t10 got really popular. to be honest, I don't believe in the steel type making the real difference anyway, it almost always comes down to how well the blade was heat treated. I'd go with a "lesser" steel from a brand with a good heat treat rep than a better steel from a brand known to miss the mark. with a larger brand like Hanwei(or actually most production brands), there is always a chance the heat treat didn't go as well as planned so you might get a better overall blade made of one of the other steels if it was heat treated better. their Raptor line blades are 5160 steel and they have a great rep for being extremely tough. I would probably focus more on the rest of the sword than the steel type, especially at those prices. with these upper end choices, a lot of the money is in the koshirae. afaik, the W&T has a good rep for being a good heavy cutter, regardless of which steel it is. I'd say if you like it, go for it. but the longer tsuka seems to be something you prefer, so the Koi might be better for you overall.
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Post by swordenthusiast on Jul 8, 2021 5:15:26 GMT
Cottontail has a good point. May just be old stock. Not sure if CAS Iberia would be able to tell you if they ever forged the W&T in 1065 or not, but that may be worth inquiring about if it is important to you.
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Post by vidar on Jul 8, 2021 9:09:31 GMT
Generally speaking, there’s nothing wrong with 1065 steel and similar (5160, 9260, even L6 would fall in this category). With a carbon content of 0.6%, it is less hard and therefore less brittle and more tough than T10 steel (or 1095). Practically this means it will dull faster but also less prone to chipping and therefore more suitable for cutting hard targets.
Rule of thumb: T10, 1095, Hanwei Swedish powder steel: ideal for cutting soft targets. 1065, 5160 etc: ideal for cutting hard targets.
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Post by Bob B on Jul 8, 2021 9:41:53 GMT
In the first link it isn't referenced where they sourced their info. In the second one-one of the guys contacted CAS. I think there's enough info one could at least get a good direction or piece together what Hanwei was doing at that time. The W&T has been around a little while, not as long as the Golden Oriole, Shinto, or Musashi of course. But steel types may have changed through the years. Josh, if memory serves me correctly the Manchurian railway steel was reserved for Bugei blades at the start, until they moved into the Swedish Powdered Steel. I know that Mr. Jensen and I both had very early Bugei Bamboo from Manchurian steel. I did get with Bugei at the time I had it and they verified the steel type on my sword. I could be wrong on the Hanwei swords but I think that was the history of it. The second link gives some insight to the old Hanwei: www.swordforum.com/vb4/showthread.php?60807-Tsunami-vs-wind-amp-thunder&highlight=Wind+and+thunder+steelwww.swordforum.com/vb4/showthread.php?52535-Hanwei-SH-1094-Forged-Steel&highlight=hanwei+steelThanks, Bob
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2021 14:26:01 GMT
There was a time, long ago, when you could email Paul Chen directly. It is fun to see some of the old threads at SFI and there are miles of reading one could do. The second thread kind of underlines the "but why?" type of discussion. Not so long ago, there was a CAS representative here to chat with but I have not seen him post in some time. I suppose the op is looking for recent reviews of the two swords in question. fwiw, the W&T is listed as T10 casiberia.com/product/wind-and-thunder-katana/sh5001Many vendors are kind of lazy in updating ad copy. When in question, ask the vendor directly. I mean actually pick up a phone and call them. As to the KOI, it is not an interesting sword to me. White ito is just one yuckies to me and "what were they thinking?" comes to mind. Cheers GC
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Post by Bob B on Jul 8, 2021 19:41:26 GMT
There was a time, long ago, when you could email Paul Chen directly. It is fun to see some of the old threads at SFI and there are miles of reading one could do. The second thread kind of underlines the "but why?" type of discussion. Not so long ago, there was a CAS representative here to chat with but I have not seen him post in some time. I suppose the op is looking for recent reviews of the two swords in question. fwiw, the W&T is listed as T10 casiberia.com/product/wind-and-thunder-katana/sh5001Many vendors are kind of lazy in updating ad copy. When in question, ask the vendor directly. I mean actually pick up a phone and call them. As to the KOI, it is not an interesting sword to me. White ito is just one yuckies to me and "what were they thinking?" comes to mind. Cheers GC Your right. There's still a treasure of information over there. It's like a public library. A quiet place to go read....LOL. I still pop over there and search, One of my first places to go. I have too. Mt memory sucks now days, I'm wearing reading glasses now and I think the grey is starting to set in. I hit the big 50 this year......oh god. Bob
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