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Post by hermannvonsalza on Mar 3, 2021 21:54:38 GMT
During my recent cleaning, I applied to remove the grease residue, a little white alcohol vinegar. But once applied, by drying this is what appeared (photos). It's strange because according to the light we do not realize it. In the photos I took it gives the impression of black spots. What to do ? And can you tell me how you clean your swords? Thank you very much.
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Greg
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Post by Greg on Mar 3, 2021 22:08:45 GMT
How long did you leave your sword to dry after using the alcohol? In higher humidities, surface oxidation can occure pretty quickly. But it might just be some sort of reaction with the residual grease that was used.
When I first get a sword, I use a general degreaser like 409, then chase that with some acetone. I don't let it air dry and use a paper towel to dry rub it and immediately apply my sword grease/oil.
I'm still using some stuff called Militech grease. Made for guns but it's kept a few of my lesser used swords safe for going on 4 years now.
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Post by hermannvonsalza on Mar 3, 2021 22:27:24 GMT
Honestly less than 10 seconds, at the same time as I applied it I could already see the spots appear. So it's a big problem or can I get rid of it? And what to use to do it? Thank you for your answer
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Mar 3, 2021 22:47:33 GMT
First time I've heard of using vinegar for cleaning a blade, it's for etching and that's what you did. I use petrol jelly on my blades and could polish such stained areas out (after etching experiments going wrong) with it and a rough cloth.
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Post by Bryan Heff on Mar 3, 2021 23:02:53 GMT
Scotch Brite! Same direction as the blade, never across. I use 3 and 1 oil and nothing else. My experience is don't mix and match too many products as they tend to react sometimes with each other and cause weird stains.
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Post by Lord Newport on Mar 4, 2021 0:50:15 GMT
During my recent cleaning, I applied to remove the grease residue, a little white alcohol vinegar. But once applied, by drying this is what appeared (photos). It's strange because according to the light we do not realize it. In the photos I took it gives the impression of black spots. What to do ? And can you tell me how you clean your swords? Thank you very much. I suggest you call Albion, explain the situation to them and ask what you should do. For lite rust I have found that "Flitz" works well. Scotch Brite! Same direction as the blade, never across. I use 3 and 1 oil and nothing else. My experience is don't mix and match too many products as they tend to react sometimes with each other and cause weird stains. There are three or four different Scotch Brite pad "grit's". I think Albion uses and recommends the "green" pad but I am not sure. A phone call to Albion to confirm would be advised.
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Greg
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Post by Greg on Mar 4, 2021 17:15:32 GMT
Oh! I missed the vinegar part of your initial post. Yeah, that's definitely the issue, I had just read "white alcohol" like rubbing alcohol.
For that level of oxidation, you can probably use any sort of stainless steel polish, or even ceramic stove polish. Another product that I use is "Mothers Mag and Aluminum Polish". All of these products are simply an abrasive paste that will remove the oxidation quickly while doing minimal abrasion to the blade. Again you'll want to polish from handle to tip to maintain the current aesthetic.
Keep us posted on your fix!
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Mar 4, 2021 21:38:01 GMT
Oh man, vinegar contains acetic acid, the amount varies from 5 to 8 or 9%. I think that I've seen it as much as 15% but am not sure on that. It works for etching a blade and for antiquing one. Never use it to clean a blade. Alcohol is a degreaser, not acid. There are also other commercial degreasers on the market. Several have already given ways to remove the oxidation such as polish, you might add Metal Glo and Brasso to the list. The difference in metal polishes is the abrasive qualities. None listed so far will harm your blade, some will give more shine than others. Many people like Scotch Brite. Whatever you use you will have to do the entire blade or at least one entire side, not just this spot you messed up and follow Albion’s original direction.
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Post by Bryan Heff on Mar 4, 2021 21:48:23 GMT
I was quick with my scotch Brite call. The Gray variety and a light machine oil in combo have never let me down. And yes the whole blade getting the treatment is the best approach. And again...always go the length direction, not across.
Pretty confident that Albion recommends the gray. Works like a charm for me for many years on many Albions in various states.
Good luck!
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Post by illustry on Mar 5, 2021 16:07:37 GMT
Bryan Heff is right about the gray scotchbrite.
One thing I'd suggest different from the tutorial as pictured: wear leather gloves. Too easy to slice up your fingers on a bad pass.
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Post by neuronic on Mar 5, 2021 20:22:55 GMT
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Post by hermannvonsalza on Mar 6, 2021 18:08:00 GMT
Hi friends, I wanted to thank you, I just finished cleaning my Crécy with Flitz polishing paste, and it worked really well!
Thank you for your valuable advice without which I could have done even worse.
I have a question: now that I have used the polishing paste, can I put my oil directly on it? I'm afraid that will make another reaction in case I have poorly cleaned.
Finally for those who are wondering why I used white vinegar I followed this video:
There you go, thank you all again.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Mar 6, 2021 19:53:49 GMT
Goes to that anyone can make a video. My French isn’t good enough to catch all in one pass but too lazy to go back 1 or 2 times. He says at one point the vinegar for removing rust, that’s a new one on me. WD-40 and #000 steel wool is a good combination for that. Also be aware that WD-40 is not a preservative and in the long run will not prevent rust. However it’s good at displacing water and neutralizing some materials. I use it after a cutting session involving water then go back with an oil.
I’m not familiar with Filtz but many polishing compounds will leave an oily film. I usually wipe down with a paper towel then apply oil. If that bothers you alcohol, alcohol alone by itself, is a degreaser which should clean the blade before applying oil.
Just had a thought; if you allowed vinegar to get between the guard and blade you could have a rest problem in the making. That can be neutralized with a solution of baking soda and water and should be oiled afterwards when dry. WWD-40 wouldn't hurt here.
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Post by hermannvonsalza on Mar 6, 2021 21:13:23 GMT
Goes to that anyone can make a video. My French isn’t good enough to catch all in one pass but too lazy to go back 1 or 2 times. He says at one point the vinegar for removing rust, that’s a new one on me. WD-40 and #000 steel wool is a good combination for that. Also be aware that WD-40 is not a preservative and in the long run will not prevent rust. However it’s good at displacing water and neutralizing some materials. I use it after a cutting session involving water then go back with an oil. I’m not familiar with Filtz but many polishing compounds will leave an oily film. I usually wipe down with a paper towel then apply oil. If that bothers you alcohol, alcohol alone by itself, is a degreaser which should clean the blade before applying oil. Just had a thought; if you allowed vinegar to get between the guard and blade you could have a rest problem in the making. That can be neutralized with a solution of baking soda and water and should be oiled afterwards when dry. WWD-40 wouldn't hurt here. Yes the WD-40 often comes back as a product to use. In any case for the vinegar I had my dose, I will not make the mistake again! I come back to your advice for the possible rust problem in the gap between the guard and the blade, should I pour water and baking soda in it, let it dry, then pour in WD40? How long to let dry? Thank you.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Mar 6, 2021 23:12:35 GMT
I can’t say definitely the exact procedure as I do not have access to your sword. You will have to go by instinct to some extent. But the procedure will go something like this: Get the soda solution in the open area between the blade and guard that the vinegar entered. Perhaps a pipe cleaner will help. After you think you’ve saturated the area flush with water. To dry perhaps a paper towel and/or pipe cleaner again. Then I’d flush with alcohol. Alcohol will absorb water. We use to used it in the lab to dry glassware. After you have done what you can to dry spray WD-40 in it. Come back a day or two later with oil. Perhaps someone else will chime in on this. Good luck.
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Post by Lord Newport on Mar 7, 2021 15:34:53 GMT
Hi friends, I wanted to thank you, I just finished cleaning my Crécy with Flitz polishing paste, and it worked really well! Thank you for your valuable advice without which I could have done even worse. I have a question: now that I have used the polishing paste, can I put my oil directly on it? I'm afraid that will make another reaction in case I have poorly cleaned. Finally for those who are wondering why I used white vinegar I followed this video: There you go, thank you all again. If you got the vinegar up under the guard and into the handle you might want to see about sending it back to Albion if they can disassemble the sword and clean it properly. It is certainly an investment worth preserving.
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Post by Lord Newport on Mar 7, 2021 18:09:32 GMT
You may also want to use Noxon on the blade. We were told by our sensei at my dojo to use Noxon on our cutting blades after a tameshigiri session to neutralize any of the acids and contaminates that might get on the blades from cutting used tatami mats.
Putting a fine gun oil or mineral oil on the blade should never hurt it.
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Post by Lord Newport on Mar 8, 2021 20:07:29 GMT
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Post by nebulatech on Mar 10, 2021 3:29:25 GMT
I have a question: now that I have used the polishing paste, can I put my oil directly on it? I am also a fan of the Mother's Mag Polish. In addition to polishing, it is intended to leave a protective coating on metal that gets very hot (radiant heat from brakes) and wet. In the abusive environment of auto tires, it can last up to 6 months. On a sword, much longer. That said, I have applied oil directly on top of polish. I'm sure there are some combinations of polish and oil that don't mix, but generally, I would imagine this is OK to do.
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marcofthecovenant
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Post by marcofthecovenant on Mar 15, 2021 21:41:47 GMT
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