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Post by perignum on Nov 9, 2020 15:13:28 GMT
Hi guys and gals,
My name is Joe Murphy and I'm an author of mainly historical fiction. As part of research into my latest bit of writing, I bought the Windlass German bastard sword. It's an amazing piece of work.
Unfortunately/fortunately (delete as appropriate) I seem to have been bitten by the collector's bug. In looking into 'battle ready' swords I was given the impression that Deepeeka are a bit hit and miss in their offerings. However, one or two (their Brescia Spadona in particular) seem to be okay bang for your buck/euro.
Long story short, I was wondering did anyone have any experience with Deepeeka's Tewkesbury sword?
Cheers,
Joe
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Nov 9, 2020 16:46:41 GMT
Ha, ha. Buying a sword is like trying to eat a peanut or eat a chip. It’s addictive and most people can’t stop with only one. Welcome to the forum and the world of sword collecting. I also have a Windlass’ German Bastard Sword. Not a bad sword at all, a bit on the heavy side, and mine exceeds the advertised weight weighing in at 4¼ lbs. It’s a powerful sword at that weight and has cut through whatever I’ve put in front of it including a pig’s leg. Sorry no experience with Deepeeka’s Tewkesbury, but if you buy make sure you choose the battle ready version as they also offer that sword for stage combat. Without having any experience with that sword I’ll say this FWIW. At 4 lb it’s a bit on the heavy side. Also it has a 3’ blade with only .5 mm distal taper. Not the best statistics for good handling. And finally Deepeeka doesn’t have a reputation for good quality but my understanding is recently especially with their Viking swords have vastly improved.
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Post by Dandelion on Nov 9, 2020 17:12:10 GMT
Buying a sword is like trying to eat a peanut or eat a chip. It’s addictive and most people can’t stop with only one. Holger calls it "rusting crack"!
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Post by perignum on Nov 9, 2020 18:23:38 GMT
Yeah, it's like the plastic crack of wargame infamy. But sharper.
Thanks guys. The first book I had published was set during the 1798 Rebellion, here in Ireland. So I'm familiar with Napoleonic arms and orders of battle. I've a bit of a blind spot, though, where the late medieval/early renaissance is concerned. Hence the German Bastard Sword.
Now that you guys mention it, it is a little blade-heavy but it leaps around in my hands. I've handled lots of actual historical weapons and they were less responsive than the GBS.
My main reason to purchase the Tewkesbury was to have a weapon from that period that I could try and teach myself some longsword techniques with and then transfer that to paper. I don't write about supermen scything through ranks of paper-armoured mooks. I'd like it to be grounded in what is plausible.
Is the Tewkesbury weight all that excessive for a longsword?
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Post by perignum on Nov 9, 2020 19:16:06 GMT
Is the Tewkesbury weight all that excessive for a longsword? Short answer, No. Ha! Cheers. The lack of pronounced distal taper means the blade is heavy, right? But, it's quite thick so it won't be whippy? Apart from that disastrous video review on this site, a Deepeeka sword isn't likely to disintegrate as soon as I hit something, though, is it? Sorry about the stupid questions....
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Post by RufusScorpius on Nov 9, 2020 19:46:33 GMT
In general, Deepeeka has a reputation for low-end swords. Their offerings were not accurate and poorly built, but strong. It's unlikely that you would break one (bend but not break). They were heavy and not very well balanced, so most serious collectors never used them for cutting or practice. I have some of their older swords and they are crude, but functional.
HOWEVER, lately they have really stepped up their game and started producing some excellent swords. The Fulham Gladius I got earlier this year is top shelf all the way. It's not perfect, but I have to look very hard to find fault in it. I have heard that others have bought Deepeeka's latest offerings and also found them to be quite excellent. It looks like the company is making significant improvements to their products.
Now, will it break if you hit something with it? Maybe. Any sword can break under the right conditions, even the most expensive customs. No guarantees. Use it properly on acceptable targets (things that simulate flesh and bone) and it shouldn't have any issues. If you hit bricks, steel pipes, and rocks, then that's abuse and if it breaks you can't blame the sword. Technique also plays a factor in a sword breaking- a bad hit could snap a blade in half.
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Post by perignum on Nov 9, 2020 20:07:33 GMT
Ha! Cheers. The lack of pronounced distal taper means the blade is heavy, right? But, it's quite thick so it won't be whippy? Apart from that disastrous video review on this site, a Deepeeka sword isn't likely to disintegrate as soon as I hit something, though, is it? Sorry about the stupid questions.... I think it's a disservice to completely run down on a beginner collectors desire for a budget sword especially when it may not really even be put through much hard use to worry about. Over analysis causing paralysis on something that will mainly be on a wall or in a corner. At the same time if I knew the budget you had I can probably offer some choices I feel more comfortable recommending. It shouldn't be super whippy or disintegrate on light or medium targets. I would only question the quality of the construction and fit and finish of the components with repeated heavy blows. I can't see what's under the hood. I would probably pour epoxy down the cross crevice just to solidify everything further. Take a look at the nut and tang. I have 2 deepeeka swords, both gladius, and they have survived light and medium targets just fine. I even drove one of the tips into a brickwall on accident and it survive with minimal damage( It has a pretty thick tip geometry). These are the two I have: www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=AH2007&name=Fulham+Gladiuskultofathena.com/product.asp?item=AH2008Thanks. That's very helpful. I'm a bit more reassured now. I think I'll take a gamble and buy it. I might actually stick a review up here as a beginner collector with a budget sword. I'm sure I'm not the only one!
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Post by Dandelion on Nov 9, 2020 21:51:11 GMT
Attention: thick blade - not necessarily stiff, thin blade - not necessarily wippy. Aaall in the heat treat, the masters say so.
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pgandy
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Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Nov 9, 2020 21:56:38 GMT
The original from which Windlass copied their German Bastard Sword is in the Wallace Collection located in London and dates at about 1515. Windlass’ version would make a good battlefield weapon. As for a civilian one on one scenario I’d want something a little faster, less fatiguing, and would leave my off hand free but by no means would count it out.
I’m sure the Tewkesbury will do what you want without falling apart. Would very much like to see your review.
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Post by elemmakil on Nov 14, 2020 7:42:43 GMT
I will say that Deepeeka does have some very good detail fittings for some of their pieces, and their blades seem to be getting better, though not great. They do seem genuinely interested in getting feedback and improving their product, so I'll give them props for that (specifically, I remember some back and forth I think on the old Kelticos forum were someone from Deepeeka was looking for feedback on one of their Celtic long sword offerings, and seemed interested in making improvements).
My direct experience is mostly with some Fetter Lane sword hilt fittings that I got off of eBay. They were not advertised as Deepeeka, but they have a stamp identical to the "Eagle Head" logo shown on their website on them. While they have some deficiencies (which I'll get to in a moment) the quality of the casting and finish were overall pretty good, and the actual detail, as compared with the original, was VERY good indeed. Obviously sans the niello work of the original surviving bits, but otherwise a very good reproduction.
My complaints are few. From a design standpoint, they've made some changes that enhance producibility at the price of strict authenticity. The original fittings were relatively thin walled and hollow with wood cores. The Deepeeka bits are partially hollow, but have solid sections slotted to accept the tang of the intended blade. This simplifies assembly of their reproduction of this sword, at the expense of excessive weight. Also, the top plate of the upper guard is made in one piece with the pommel, which of course is inaccurate. Still, not at all bad, and I'm currently shaping some horn knife scales to fit in the "sandwich" of the upper and lower guard plates for mounting on an old Del Tin/Museum Replicas "Historical Excalibur" sword. My other minor complaint was that the pieces were not strictly "level" and I had to flatten them with a hammer on my anvil to make them perfectly flat. Not a big deal but something to be aware of if one wants to get a set and do your own Fetter Lane project.
The other piece that I have (from the same eBay vendor) that I'm 99% certain is Deepeeka is a pattern welded Birka langsax (blade is a little over 17" long) that I paid ~$250-ish for. It's overall VERY good - I see no issues with the blade welds, and the patterning is overall historically correct - even has a high carbon edge welded on to a patterned core. The sheath is amazing with very detailed fittings, apparently based on a specific find. I'm going to need to hunt through the Birka archaeological books and see if I can find the original. Depending on what I discover, I may decide to take this one apart and do some modifications to improve it (if only to carve the grip - as it is it is fairly boring and screams for some decorative work, even though the lack of such is not in any way historically inaccurate)
So overall my impression of Deepeeka's recent work is quite favorable, with the caveat that you aren't getting an Albion, Vince Evans, etc. level of craftsmanship. But for the low price point one can get some interesting stuff, and they do strive to provide a pretty wide range of offerings, with a surprising degree of attention to historical detail, even if some production short cuts are taken.
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Post by perignum on Nov 17, 2020 11:42:00 GMT
Weird. I was just sitting down to write a review. I'll post it in the review section in a minute or two.
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Post by tommyh on Nov 19, 2020 3:33:55 GMT
FYI: OP, the Windlass German Bastard Sword isn't the most historically accurate thing. Check out Medieval Review's "Windlass Blunders in Reproductino Design Part 1" on YouTube.
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Post by perignum on Nov 19, 2020 20:46:58 GMT
FYI: OP, the Windlass German Bastard Sword isn't the most historically accurate thing. Check out Medieval Review's "Windlass Blunders in Reproductino Design Part 1" on YouTube. Yeah, I saw that. Crazy stuff. It's ironic that Windlass built a very good hand and a half cutter completely by mistake. As long as it's historically plausible, I'm not too fussed about it being an exact replica. I did a talk and reading at a Napoleonic battle reenactment once and got a chance to chat to the reenactors and historians present. It turns out it was really common for 'field' arms to be very different from the majority of stuff you see in collections and museums. Sort of like the difference between dress uniform and combat fatigues. Something as iconic as the heavy cavalry sabre was often ground down at the point and the guard. It looked very different in practice to the way it looks on paper. It hit like a razor-edged crowbar but the hatchet end meant that once you got inside the cavalryman's guard, he had no leverage to swing and no point to poke you with. A lot of the heavy cavalry blades actually used in combat were spear-pointed and 2-3 inches shorter than they should have been.
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