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Post by bas on Sept 6, 2022 1:32:04 GMT
The other recent arrival is this finely detailed silver hilted French smallsword. The blade is marked: Guyon L'aine au Roy De La Chine Sur Le Pont St Michel a Paris Which translates to: Guyon (The Elder) to The King of China St Michel Bridge Paris. Guyon was a sword cutler from about 1750 to 1767. And the St Michel Bridge was a retail address in Paris. Given the way shops were identified at the time, and the lack of a king in China, it is most likely that “The King of China” was a shop name that Guyon worked from to sell his swords. There are three stamps on one of the annelets that are likely to be hallmarks, but I am still trying to identify them so can’t confirm if the hilt is silver or not, but given the wear on the decorations I believe it to be likely. (If anyone can identify them, please let me know) The caduceus of Hermes (Roman - Mercury) features prominently in the decorations and this association with commerce could indicate that the sword belonged to a wealthy merchant (since the hilts were made to order from patterns). Unfortunately, we’ll never know, but it is fun to speculate.  Interestingly, even though it is 10 grams lighter than the smallsword with the boatshell guard. It’s more forward point of balance makes it feel slightly heavier in the hand. | Length Over All: | 912 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 760 mm |
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| | Curve: |
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| | Point of balance: | 105 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 420 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
|
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 81 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 62 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 31 mm
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| - Thickness
| 2.0 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 31 to 27 mm
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| Grip
|
|
|
| - Outside Length
| 116 mm
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|
| - Inside Length
| 82 mm
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|
| - Width
| 25 to 19 mm
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|
| - Thickness
| 20 to 17 mm
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 20.8 mm
| 6.3 mm
|
| - 200mm
| 15.2 mm
| 4.4 mm
|
| - 400mm
| 13.2 mm
| 3.7 mm
|
| - 600mm
| 10.8 mm
| 2.7 mm
|
| - 750mm
| 5.3 mm
| 1.1 mm
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Post by bas on Oct 27, 2022 5:14:43 GMT
Just when I promised myself never to import another sword with ivory, what do I go and do? I buy another mameluke sabre….  This is a late Georgian era Full Dress mameluke sabre marked to the 12th Lancers. While there had been a well-established tradition of carrying mameluke sabres amongst officers of the British army that goes back to the Egyptian campaigns of 1798 – 1801. It wasn’t until 25th April 1822 that they were officially sanctioned in the Dress Regulations for the 9th, 12th and 16th Lancers.
The regulations were all prescribed a 'mameluke-hilted' sword with a plain metal scabbard for dress wear and a velvet-covered scabbard for full dress. I imagine that the difference between Dress and Full Dress would have been determined by who attended the occasion or function. In 1826 the regulations ordered in Full Dress a ‘mameluke-hilted’ for officers of the Hussars and in 1831 a mameluke inspired pattern was introduced for General and Staff officers. Regardless, officers of may other Light Cavalry and some Heavy Cavalry units continued to carry mameluke sabres into the early 20th Century.
This sabre can be attributed to the 12th (The Prince of Wales) Royal Lancers by the blade decoration which features the regimental title, crowned crossed lances and laurel wreaths. Going by the style of decoration it dates to between 1822 and 1830, with it likely to be at the earlier end of that range. I purchased the sword from Richard Dellar, and it features in his book, The British Cavalry Sword 1788 – 1912; The Companion Volume Plates 12.27 – 12.28 alongside a similar sword from the 9th Lancers.
| Length Over All: | 878 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 737 mm |
| | Curve: | 45 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 105 mm |
| | Sword Weight: | 700 grams |
| Total Weight:
| 1270 grams
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| Guard
|
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 140 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 23.2 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 78.0 mm
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| - Thickness
| 15.8 - 7.2 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
|
|
| Grip
|
|
| - Outside Length
| 118 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 93 mm
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| - Width
| 28.9 to 23.0 mm
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| - Thickness
| 24.6 to 21.4 mm
|
| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| - Ricasso
| 27.5 mm
| 5.2 mm
| - 200mm
| 27.9 mm
| 3.4 mm
| - 400mm
| 26.9 mm
| 2.6 mm
| - 600mm
| 28.3 mm
| 1.6 mm
| - 700mm
| 22.6 mm
| 1.4 mm
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Oct 27, 2022 13:29:06 GMT
I spent many minutes admiring those rapiers, especially the top one. Thanks.
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Post by bas on Oct 28, 2022 5:47:33 GMT
I spent many minutes admiring those rapiers, especially the top one. Thanks. Thank you, I think you might like the next sword I post..... |
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Post by bas on Oct 28, 2022 5:58:05 GMT
A new sword for the collection that is a significant diversion from my core collecting theme. Circa the mid-17th Century, this style of sword is unique to the British Isles and was popular in the from around the time of the English Civil wars (1642 - 1651) up until the 1670s. The prominent features of the style are a three-bar basket connected to a round pommel by screws. Joining the bars, are usually one or two pairs of crossbars across the front. The top of the hilt is normally a bowl shape with a flat tail at the back. The blades can be either double edged broadswords (like this one) or single edged backswords. In period this likely how they would have been described in armouries or wills. Also distinctive is the level of decoration that features on the guard, with faces being the most common but not exclusive theme. The meaning behind the faces is lost, but some theories are that it was the Martyred King Charles I. And while this may be true for specific swords, the faces appear on swords with provenance to both sides of the conflict so is unlikely to be true. To modern collectors and books, these are called Mortuary swords, a name that came into being in the Victorian era. Again, it is not known why, it could be the likeness of the King or that many swords were sold out of Church collections where they had been used for funeral rites. In 1700s it was the practice to donate a soldier’s sword to his church, who would paint them black and put them on display at funerals. In the 19th Century, many churches were renovating and sold off these swords to interested collectors. Because of the practice of painting the metal, many remained in very good condition. Typically associated with the cavalry, they were used by infantry as well, although a decorated sword such as this would have belonged to a man of some means. This sword is likely to be an infantry mans’ sword due to its’ lighter weight and shorter length, even if we account for it having lost the point of the blade. Another common modification to swords of this age was the replacement of the grip and wire. Wood does not age as well as steel and it is safe to assume that most 17th Century swords have had the grip re-done. Early collectors and museums looked on artifacts as works of art more than pieces of history, so like a painting restoration, they sought to re-make swords in their image of what they thought it should be. I believe that this sword possibly came from one such church, as the blade is still stained and there are traces of black finish on the guard. Most of the blades for these swords came from three sources, the English Hanslow smiths, The Low Countries and of course Solingen. However, one cannot go by the markings alone, as forgery was wide spread. The blade on this sword has several interesting features. It is marked on both sides with the words: | MEFECIT | Running Wolf and Tree mark
| SAHAGVM | | SOLINGEN |
| SAHAGVM |
Sahagvm is a reference to Alsonso de Sahagun, el viejo a legendary Spanish sword smith of the 16th Century. The name features prominently on Dutch ‘Walloon’ swords of the time and is an obvious forgery in line with the ‘Andrea Ferara’ swords of the Scottish Highlanders. Furthermore, the orientation of the wolf in relation to the text is incorrect likely ruling out manufacture in Solingen proper. However, this was a time of trouble, and many families of smiths left their German base to settle in the Low Countries, Britain or further abroad. A light sword, the blade specifications are still functional and a close match to those of my 1796 Pattern Heavy Cavalry dismounted service sword with the Andrea Ferara blade. | Length Over All: | 992 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 830 mm |
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| | Curve: | n/a
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| | Point of balance: | 85 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 860 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 110 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| Overall: 92 mm
| Left: 40.8 mm
| Right: 48.7
| - Height (Including langets)
| 30 mm
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| - Thickness
| 1.8 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| Front: 48 mm
| Left: 37.7 mm
| Right: 42.2 mm
| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 146 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 100 mm
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| - Width
| 26.4 to 22.6 mm
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| - Thickness
| 22.5 to 21.9 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 35.3 mm
| 5.6 mm
| 4.2 / 4.3 mm
| - 200mm
| 30.5 mm
| 4.1 mm
| 2.5 / 2.8 mm
| - 400mm
| 26.1 mm
| 3.4 mm
| 2.0 / 2.0 mm
| - 600mm
| 23.8 mm
| 2.5 mm
| 1.7 / 1.4 mm
| - 800mm
| 15.3 mm
| 1.4 mm
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Oct 28, 2022 12:17:44 GMT
I found the history lesson interesting concerning the possible origin of the name Mortuary swords. I was not aware of the tradition of giving the church a soldier’s sword nor the painting. I am afraid the closet I’ve come to that is my CS Mortuary Sword, which has proven to be a good one. This example is from CS’s first batch that caused much controversy and was down right dangerous due to its design. This one was gifted to me by a fellow forum member and I rebuilt making it safer to use. And as always, the statistics are much appreciated.
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Post by bas on Feb 18, 2023 8:38:21 GMT
A new year and new swords...
The first is another French cavalry officers's sword with the 'Garde de Bataille' hilt. This along side the British 1803 pattern is probably my favorite style of sword of the era. Unfortunately it's missing the scabbard and an emblem on the guard, but I'll see if I can do something about that.
Blade is has some etching remaining and a 'Solingen Rose' on the spine, otherwise it is unmarked. 
As you can see from the stats, it's a heavy sword, very much in the theme of the AN XI 'sabre of the line' cuirassier troopers sword, certainly not a nimble sword for delicate point work...
 | Length Over All: | 1,005 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 945 mm |
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| | Curve: | 5 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 160 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 1,050 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
|
|
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 115 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 113 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 28 mm
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| - Thickness
| 2.5 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 39 to 36 mm
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| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 145 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 110 mm
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| - Width
| 36 to 29 mm
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| - Thickness
| 23 to 21 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 31.2 mm
| 8.5 mm
| 7.9 / 5.9 mm
| - 200mm
| 26.0 mm
| 5.8 mm
| 2.1 / 2.3 mm
| - 400mm
| 24.2 mm
| 4.9 mm
| 2.2 / 2.4 mm
| - 600mm
| 22.4 mm
| 4.8 mm
| 2.1 /2.1 mm
| - 800mm
| 20.6 mm
| 3.8 mm
| 1.9 / 1.9 mm
| - 900mm
| 17.0 mm
| 3.1 mm
| 1.7 / 1.7 mm
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Post by bas on Feb 20, 2023 20:33:50 GMT
Referred to as the ‘Côtes de Melon’, after the distinctive pommel shaped like the ‘ribs of the melon’. This sabre style gained popularity among French officers from about 1800 and remained in use until the introduction of the model 1821 infantry and 1822 cavalry sabres during the Restoration era. Aside from the pommel, the type is distinguished by the simple stirrup hilt with langets and a single quillion. The grips are made from hardwood and can be checkered or have longitudinal groves. Often the knuckle guard has a stylised olive decorative feature. Swords belonging to superior officers would have been silver-plated. The swords of mounted or cavalry officers can be identified by their length and dual suspension rings on the scabbard. Superior officers typically had ornate metal scabbards, while infantry officers preferred shorter sabres with a frog stud for use with the cross-belt. An officer of one of the light cavalry regiments most likely owned this sabre. The blade is particularly large and sturdy, plus the scabbard has dual suspension rings. The blade is decorated in the typical oriental fashion of the late 18th Century with faux Islamic / cabalistic script and an ‘Ottoman’s head’. There is a lovely Solingen rose on the blade's spine but no other identifying manufacturer's marks.
The simple ‘baguette’ shaped langets, blade decorations and plain knuckle guard may indicate that this is an early example of the type, or that it was used by an officer of another nation, imitating French fashion. | Length Over All: | 965 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 825 mm |
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| | Curve: | 37 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 180 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 800 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,050 grams
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 122 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 22.7 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 29.7 mm
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| - Thickness
| 5.5 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 39 to 31 mm
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| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 130 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 110 mm
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| - Width
| 35 to 20 mm
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| - Thickness
| 23 to 19 mm
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 35.8 mm
| 10.2 mm
| 3.7 mm
| - 200mm
| 31.9 mm
| 5.9 mm
| 1.1 mm
| - 400mm
| 30.5 mm
| 5.3 mm
| 1.7 mm
| - 600mm
| 31.5 mm
| 3.7 mm
| 0.9 mm
| - 800mm
| 29.7 mm
| 2.4 mm
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Post by bas on Mar 11, 2023 21:41:18 GMT
‘Pinch of Snuff’ Basket-hilted broadsword.
While the bulk of my collection focuses on swords from the late 18th and early 19th Century. There are some pieces that fall outside of that but are still very much in the ‘oh I want one of those!’ category.
The iconic basket-hilted broadsword or backsword is very much in this group.
This sword was a gift from my family for a milestone birthday. It is a composite (as many basket hilts are) of a brass ‘Pinch of Snuff’ basket, London made blade and replacement grip.
This basket style is named after the famous painting of a Scottish soldier reaching into his snuff box with his claymore under his arm. The painting is from 1750 and is attributed to William Delacour. It is the first known image showing this unique style of basket.
(Note that at this time, Scottish basket hilts were commonly called claymores, so the term is correct for this period. Prior to that it was also used to describe a type of great sword).
Typically these hilts are steel but I have seen at least one other identical hilt sold at auction last year.
The blade is from an earlier sword dated to 1668, it is marked on both sides with:
THOMAS HVMFFREIES
LONDIN FECIT
ANNO 1668
The spelling is fairly typical of a time before dictionaries and the standardisation of the English language. The inscription can be read as:
Thomas Humphries, London made, year 1668
Unfortunately I haven’t been able to find any other examples of Thomas’ work.
Stats:
| Length Over All: | 940 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 795 mm |
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| | Curve: |
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| | Point of balance: | 45 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 1,010 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 104 mm
|
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 110 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
|
|
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| - Thickness
| 3.9 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 40 to 35 mm
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| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 145 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 105 mm
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| - Width
| 33 to 28 mm
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| - Thickness
| 25 mm
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 31.0 mm
| 4.9 mm
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| - 200mm
| 25.0 mm
| 3.5 mm
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| - 400mm
| 20.5 mm
| 3.2 mm
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| - 600mm
| 20.5 mm
| 2.5 mm
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| - 780mm
| 12 mm
| 1.0 mm
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Post by bas on Mar 11, 2023 21:48:03 GMT
Grenadier Officer’s sabre in the 1803 Pattern ‘Flank Officers’ sabre style.
This is another one of those wonderful swords from the Georgian era that are so hard to neatly slot into a category as modern collectors are wont to do.
The sword has a slotted guard and lions head pommel that is identical to the 1803 Pattern. However, instead of having the GR Cypher of King George III - the reigning monarch at the time. It has the flaming bomb emblem of the grenadiers surrounded by a wreath of Acanthus leaf or possibly grape leaves.
The Acanthus leaf featured strongly in classical Greek and Roman art and was picked up in the Neo-classical style of the Georgian / Napoleonic era.
Because the blade is plain is is difficult to date the sword, but we know that by 1800 Flank officers (Grenadier and Light Company) had been granted leave to carry sabres in place of the 1796 Pattern infantry officers sword. In 1803 this became regulation with the introduction of the 1803 Pattern Officers sword.
The 1803 was an accumulation of features, such as the slotted guard and lions head pommel, that were already popular at the time. So it is possible that this sabre pre-dated the 1803 Pattern. But in the balance of it’s condition and features I suspect this is not the case.
The sabre has a long, heavy blade with a grossly exaggerated curve. Truth be told, it is highly inappropriate for the fighting style taught in this time. It was however very fashionable, and many officers of the British and French armies were more than happy to forego practically in favour of fashion.
In the end, it doesn’t really matter what the pattern is. It’s a great looking sword that nicely illustrates one of the unique style of swords from the era.
Different 1803 Pattern Officer’s sabres showing the variation in length and curve:
Stats:
| Length Over All: | 956 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 822 mm |
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| | Curve: | 114 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 170 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 890 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,450 grams
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 104 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 54 mm
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|
| - Height (Including langets)
|
|
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| - Thickness
| 3.5 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 58 to 44 mm
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| Grip
|
|
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| - Outside Length
| 138 mm
|
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| - Inside Length
| 96 mm
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| - Width
| 35 to 29 mm
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| - Thickness
| 23 to 21 mm
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 37.1 mm
| 8.4 mm
| 4.1 mm
| - 200mm
| 32.4 mm
| 4.8 mm
| 2.2 mm
| - 400mm
| 31.7 mm
| 4.5 mm
| 1.8 mm
| - 600mm
| 31.9 mm
| 2.0 mm
| 1.5 mm
| - 800mm
| 16.8 mm
| 1.4 mm
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Post by bas on Mar 12, 2023 21:12:49 GMT
British 1796 Pattern Heavy Cavalry Officer’s undress sword
This is my second 1796 Pattern heavy cavalry officer’s undress sword. Undress means that this was the sword that the officer would carry while in the field or on active service. In addition to his regular uniform he was required to own a dress uniform and one for full dress. The latter being worn when at official functions or at a ball. For officers of the heavy cavalry this was sword with a gilded boatshell hilt and straight blade. These can be found with either steel or leather scabbards which might be the difference between dress and full dress.
As the British army did not have many heavy cavalry regiments, this pattern of sword is significantly less common than the 1796 Pattern for light cavalry. To find one with its scabbard is even rarer. So when this one came available, I jumped on it.
As needs must, I have sold my other 1796 HC, but while I have them side by side it is interesting to see the differences between them. Because all officer swords were private purchase there is considerable variation between the examples. Some have plain blades while others have engraving enhances by blue and gilt. The guards differ in their detailing and can be symmetrical or asymmetrical in accordance with the desires of the officer.  My first sword has a much larger guard than the second but a shorter grip. It is thicker at the base of a plain blade while narrowing down quickly with a complex distal taper. My guess is that this sword would have belonged to a more junior officer, being less ostentatious.
It is, however no less functional as a sword and has a more pronounced spear tip making it more suitable for thrusting. A common complaint of the original blade profile. In contrast, the new swords has a marginally thinner blade with a linear distal taper. It retains the remnants of the original bluing and gilt. Showing the typical British coat of Arms, GR cypher and attacking cavalry man. The furrell and back-strap of the grip are also faceted for stylistic effect.
Stats:
| Length Over All: | 1,040 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 890 mm |
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| | Curve: | 5 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 135 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 980 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,580 grams
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 130 mm
|
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 102 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 25 mm
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| - Thickness
| 3.8 to 3.2 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 53 to 49 mm
|
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| Grip
|
|
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| - Outside Length
| 141 mm
|
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| - Inside Length
| 134 mm
|
|
| - Width
| 38 to 30 mm
|
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| - Thickness
| 28 to 24 mm
|
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 37.8 mm
| 7.6 mm
| 3.8 mm
| - 200mm
| 34.4 mm
| 5.6 mm
| 1.8 mm
| - 400mm
| 32.9 mm
| 4.6 mm
| 1.5 mm
| - 600mm
| 32.6 mm
| 3.6 mm
| 1.0 mm
| - 800mm
| 32.4 mm
| 1.6 mm
|
| - 850mm
| 29.0 mm
| 1.3 mm
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Post by pellius on Mar 13, 2023 1:52:42 GMT
Outstanding - as always!
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Post by bas on Jun 29, 2023 3:46:22 GMT
Another sword to add to the thread, a French m1845 Infantry officers sabre. This one I am only the temporary custodian of as it will be moved on in the future.
However it is an affordable and functional sword with lots of history behind it. One could do a lot worse than to add one of these to their own collection.
Stats:
| Length Over All: | 915 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 770 mm |
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| | Curve: | 10 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 90 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 830 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,370 grams
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| Guard
|
|
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 89 mm
|
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 80 mm
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| - Height (Including quillon)
| 36 mm
|
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| - Thickness
| 1.9 to 3.1 mm
|
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 35 to 38 mm
|
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| Grip
|
|
|
| - Outside Length
| 145 mm
|
|
| - Inside Length
| 105 mm
|
|
| - Width
| 26 to 32 mm
|
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| - Thickness
| 22 to 25 mm
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 29.8 mm
| 7.7 mm
| 5.7 mm
| - 200mm
| 26.4 mm
| 6.0 mm
| 1.3 mm
| - 400mm
| 25.7 mm
| 5.2 mm
| 1.0 mm
| - 600mm
| 26.4 mm
| 4.0 mm
| 0.9 mm
| - 720mm
| 17.6 mm
| 2.6 mm
| 0.8 mm
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Post by bas on Jul 11, 2023 2:50:30 GMT
Georgian era Yeomanry officers sabre styled after the 1796 Pattern light cavalry sabre.
Produced by William Henry Archer of Dublin using a Solingen made blade imported J J Runkel. This sabre is another example of the many quirky swords that abounded during this period. While the government was working to establish regulation pattern swords, many officers, especially those in the yeomanry, volunteers or militia were content to continue using the equipment that best suited them. As a result there are many surviving examples that are next to impossible to attribute to a unit or branch or service. In only a few examples are we lucky enough to have identifying inscriptions on the sword or scabbard. And even these need to be viewed with caution. Stylistically, animal motifs were a common decorative feature on swords of this time. With the lions head so popular that it became part of several British Pattern swords, including the sabre still in service with British naval officers. A variation of the animal theme. horse-heads pommels seemed to have been more common among the cutlers from Ireland, with Archer and Reed the more frequently encountered suppliers. Because the hilt is broadly modeled on the 1796 Pattern light cavalry sabre, with the dual langets, P-shaped stirrup guard and a very functional blade of cavalry proportions, I believe it would have belonged to an Yeomanry officer based in Ireland. The gilt hilt also precludes it from having belonged to a regular army officer. At the time, the yeomanry had been raised from the upper classes as a reserve force ready to protect Great Britain should Napoleonic France attempt to invade. They also had the secondary function of 'keeping the peace'. In a time before an established police force, the yeomanry were often called upon to break-up any unrest. Which meant that the ones based in Ireland were more active than most. I estimate that this sword dates from 1798 to 1802 based near identical presentation examples produced by William Archer which have inscriptions dated to 1800. The blade is also decorated with the pre-1801 coat of arms so is unlikely to date after 1803. William Henry Archer started his career as a sword cutler in 1783 when he married Margaret Shaw, widow of Richard Shaw. Richard Shaw, was a sword cutler from 1765 to 1782 when he died of injuries caused by the collapse of Music Hall floor. Margaret continued her husbands business in her name until she married William Archer in 1783. It is quite possible that William was working as an apprentice for the Shaws at the time and the marriage was a way to maintain the business. Such arrangements were not unheard of in a time when women were not allowed to own property or enter into contracts. Archer continued remained in business until his death in 1830, during this time he also served as Lord Mayor of Dublin in 1812 and 1830 so he must have been a successful and respected businessman of his time.
| Length Over All: | 954 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 820 mm |
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| | Curve: | 55 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 135 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 970 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,430 grams
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 120 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 40 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 34 mm
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| - Thickness
| 5.7 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 77 to 44 mm
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| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 120 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 95 mm
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| - Width
| 31 to 36 mm
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| - Thickness
| 24 to 22 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 37.7 mm
| 9.9 mm
| 3.1 mm
| - 200mm
| 32.7 mm
| 6.1 mm
| 1.7 mm
| - 400mm
| 32.7 mm
| 5.5 mm
| 1.3 mm
| - 600mm
| 36.8 mm
| 2.7 mm
| 0.2 mm
| - 750mm
| 39.2 mm
| 1.6 mm
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| - 800mm
| 17.9 mm
| 1.2 mm
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Post by bas on Jul 28, 2023 1:32:39 GMT
17th Century 'Walloon' Sword
I've held back from making a dedicated post while I attempted to researched it further. Unfortunately, there just isn't enough information available to come to any definitive conclusions and we are left to speculate based on snippets of information and clues we find in the objects themselves.
This style of sword is typically described and the 'Amsterdam town guard sword.' And is a sub-class of the broader 'Walloon' sword.
Calling these 'Walloon swords' is another modern collectors' practice of convenience which is believed to have originated with the French cavalry sword; 'Epee Wallone' which was in service from the late 17th to the middle of the 18th Century.
Walloon swords are believed to have originated in the German states of the Holy Roman Empire during the time of the Thirty Years War. They are identified by the asymmetrical disk shaped guards, solid knuckle guard with two of more side branches. The guards can be solid and decorated with grotesque faces, animals or plant motifs, or they can be perforated. Typically they will have a thumb-ring attached on the left underside of the guard. Blades can be either double or single edged.
The 'Amsterdam' Walloon sword, named because of the Amsterdam Coat of Arms invariably found stamped into the ricasso, is a very distinct sub-type that features a perforated asymmetrical disk guard decorated with pierced suns surrounded by moons. It is finished by a short upturned rear quillon. They have a single knuckle bow which is fixed to the ball pommel by a screw and a thumb-ring on the left side that extends out to the edge of the guard. The grip is wrapped with wire and finished at both ends with a 'Turks head' knot. The blades are long, double edged with a single fuller at the base. They are invariably stamped with triple Xs under a crown Coat of Arms for Amsterdam. The surviving examples are very uniform for this period in time, making it is possible that this was the first European pattern sword produced.
While the link to Amsterdam is clear in the markings, it is unlikely that this type of sword was issued to the cities guard or militia. The number of surviving examples indicate that these were made in too large quantities to have been issued to a small localised force.
During the 17th Century, The Netherlands was a republic of seven provinces. And rather than a standing national army, each province would have supplied and maintained their own levies in times of war. One possibility is that these swords were supplied to the cavalry of the Province of Holland, of which Amsterdam was the economic capital.
Another theory is that the French experience of 'Walloon' swords, encountered during their war with the Dutch in 1672 to 1673. Dissatisfied with their current cavalry swords, French King Louis XIV ordered that his cavalry be equipped with a new sword of the 'Walloon' type. This is discussed in an article in the French magazine Gazette des Armes.
However that doesn't explain the presence of the Amsterdam Coat of Arms on these swords. Then again, Amsterdam was a major mercantile center for Europe, and it is possible that the French order was brokered by Dutch merchants who placed their mark on the blades when they arrived from Solingen.
It should also be noted that the Amsterdam mark is often accompanied by the Solingen blade smiths' own mark. On this sword the makers mark is mostly obscured by the guard, but you can just make out the top of a crown at the ricasso (the horizontal stamp is another verson of the Dutch markings).
In the hand, this is a beast of a sword, the grip and guard are large to accommodate gloves and the blade is very long, suitable for fighting from horseback. But despite its' proportions, it is not a heavy or unwieldy sword.
| Length Over All: | 1,080 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 920 mm |
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| | Curve: |
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| | Point of balance: | 120 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 990 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 120 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 116 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 40 mm
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| - Thickness
| 1.1 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 42 to 34 mm
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| Grip
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| - Outside Length
| 145 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 120 mm
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| - Width
| 28 to 24 mm
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| - Thickness
| 24 to 22 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 40.0 mm
| 6.7 mm
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| - 200mm
| 29.3 mm
| 4.3 mm
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| - 400mm
| 25.6 mm
| 3.3 mm
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| - 600mm
| 24.9 mm
| 2.9 mm
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| - 800mm
| 22.0 mm
| 2.1 mm
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| - 900mm
| 11.7 mm
| 1.4 mm
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Post by bas on Feb 1, 2024 1:04:23 GMT
Early 18th Century Venetian 'Schiavona' Sword
The Schiavona is an iconic basket-hilted sword that was closely associated with the Italian city state of Venice. The earliest examples are believed to have come from an elite body of Slavic soldiers hired by the Venetian council, and date back as far as the late 16th Century.
Schiavona are identified by their unique basket hilts and 'cats head' pommels. The renowned sword historian and author, Ewart Oakeshott grouped the schiavona basket hilts into two broad categories, the simplified Type 1 with it's broad flat bars, and the Type 2 of lattice work design.
They Type 1 hilt began to appear around the early 1600's and the first Type 2 between 1620 and 1630. Type 1's remained in use for most of the 17th Century after which Type 2 hilts became dominant.
Over the life of schiavona swords, (1600 - 1797) their hilts became increasingly complex and ornate as they became associated with the character of Venice, with the upper levels of society also carrying their own schiavonas.
Based on the features of the hilt, this sword most likely dates to 1710 - 1740. The iron pommel and 93 cm blade suggest that it is of munitions grade and was likely carried by a regular cavalry man.
| Length Over All: | 1,075 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 930 mm |
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| | Curve: |
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| | Point of balance: | 165 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 1,090 grams |
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| Total Weight:
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 130 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 95 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
| 40 mm
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| - Thickness
| 2.4 to 3.6 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 20 to 40 mm
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| Grip
|
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| - Outside Length
| 135 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 94 mm
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| - Width
| 24 to 33 mm
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| - Thickness
| 18 to 23 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 37.2 mm
| 4.5 mm
| 4.2 mm
| - 200mm
| 35.0 mm
| 3.8 mm
| 3.5 mm
| - 400mm
| 32.5 mm
| 3.4 mm
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| - 600mm
| 29.1 mm
| 2.7 mm
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| - 800mm
| 25.0 mm
| 2.3 mm
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| - 900mm
| 21.1 mm
| 1.9 mm
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Post by bas on Feb 2, 2024 1:53:15 GMT
French Cavalry Officers' Sabre a l'OrientaleCirca 1810 - 1830, while not an especially embellished sword, this one attacted my attention because of the Eastern shamshir style blade. This is a large and very functional sword with interesting blade statistics that really set it apart from the European blades I'm more familiar with.
| Length Over All: | 950 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 805 mm |
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| | Curve: | 75 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 170 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 920 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 1,540 grams
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| Guard
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 150 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 29 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
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| - Thickness
| 8.6 to 16.1 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
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| Grip
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| - Outside Length
| 125 mm
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| - Inside Length
| 94 mm
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| - Width
| 27 to 33 mm
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| - Thickness
| 23 to 27 mm
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| Blade Width
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| Blade Thickness
| Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 33.3 mm
| 6.5 mm
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| - 200mm
| 26.6 mm
| 5.3 mm
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| - 400mm
| 22.7 mm
| 4.7 mm
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| - 600mm
| 20.1 mm
| 4.6 mm
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| - 750mm
| 14.8 mm
| 3.5 mm
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| - 800mm
| 5.9 mm
| 2.1 mm
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Post by bas on Feb 8, 2024 1:03:01 GMT
French infantry officers 'Sabre à Garde Tournante'
I really like quirky swords and these rotating guards especially appeal to me, so when I was offered another I just had to snap it up. This one has the more typical single outside guard which has been scalloped along the edges for decoration. It's also shorter than my other one and only has the frog stud on the scabbard chape, meaning that it belonged to a dismounted officer.
| Length Over All: | 865 mm
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| | Blade Length: | 740 mm |
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| | Curve: | 14 mm
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| | Point of balance: | 111 mm |
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| | Sword Weight: | 610 grams |
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| Total Weight:
| 780 grams
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| Guard
|
|
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| - Length (Across the hand)
| 119 mm
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| - Width (Across the hand)
| 93 / 57 mm
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| - Height (Including langets)
|
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| - Thickness
| 2.0 to 3.9 mm
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| - Inside (Grip to guard)
| 48 mm
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| Grip
|
|
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| - Outside Length
| 125 mm
|
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| - Inside Length
| 105 mm
|
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| - Width
| 29 to 35 mm
|
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| - Thickness
| 22 to 28 mm
|
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| Blade Width
|
| Blade Thickness
| Thickness Inside Fuller
| - Ricasso
| 35.2 mm
| 7.8 mm
| 3.5 mm
| - 200mm
| 29.3 mm
| 3.9 mm
| 1.5 mm
| - 400mm
| 27.1 mm
| 3.5 mm
| 1.6 mm
| - 600mm
| 26.1 mm
| 2.0 mm
| 1.4 mm
| - 700mm
| 19.4 mm
| 1.3 mm
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Post by madirish on Feb 11, 2024 22:27:16 GMT
any interest in having others add to this with measurements of their own examples?
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Post by bas on Feb 12, 2024 0:20:26 GMT
any interest in having others add to this with measurements of their own examples? I think it would be interesting/valuable if others added their own antique examples to the thread. |
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