|
Post by leed on Nov 4, 2020 20:27:49 GMT
Hi guys.... Wondering your thoughts on katana grip diameter. Both my wak and tanto around 4.25". My katana seems closer to 4.1", and seems hard to control on hard swings and weak to hold solidly on hard, 2 handed swings. My middle finger touches base of palm on my katana. 1/8" gap on others. What is a good way to increase grip diameter of a kat? Tennis grip? Fiberglass and resin? Friction tape? I know, I'm a dork.
|
|
|
Post by Timo Nieminen on Nov 5, 2020 0:27:16 GMT
4.25" seems really fat for a tanto grip. Most of the katana grips are around 4" circumference at the fuchi. I think I prefer a little under 4". With a 4" grip, my middle and ring fingers touch the base of my thumb. With a 4.25" grip, they stop short of touching (squeezing the grip gets my middle finger to just touch). I have average width hands (for an adult male), and fingers a little longer than average.
4.25" is OK, but I wouldn't want anything fatter than that. As thin as 3.5" is fine for a tanto, and should be OK for a katana, too. IMO, a little thinner than ideal is better than a little fatter than ideal. Too fat means that your hand needs to be more tense for a secure grip. Relaxed is better, and a thinner grip is good for relaxed.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 0:38:56 GMT
Thanks guys.... Still up in the air, I play tennis with a 4 3/8, considered big for my size.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 1:48:35 GMT
I wonder.... Maybe tanto and wak is meant for bare handed usage, while ko and kat designed with gloves for hand protection. Sorta makes sense, as wak and tanto is for unprepared situations while ko and kat is carried with danger on the horizon. Anyways, I've been swinging machetes for the past 22 years, being a low grade gardener, and all my 5 machetes have grips from 4.25 and up. A small grip causes more blisters and callouses, it seems to me.
|
|
|
Post by Lord Newport on Nov 5, 2020 3:04:47 GMT
I wonder.... Maybe tanto and wak is meant for bare handed usage, while ko and kat designed with gloves for hand protection. Sorta makes sense, as wak and tanto is for unprepared situations while ko and kat is carried with danger on the horizon. Anyways, I've been swinging machetes for the past 22 years, being a low grade gardener, and all my 5 machetes have grips from 4.25 and up. A small grip causes more blisters and callouses, it seems to me. I don't think comparing non stop use of a machete in a commercial setting is analogous.
|
|
|
Post by treeslicer on Nov 5, 2020 4:03:33 GMT
Hi guys.... Wondering your thoughts on katana grip diameter. Both my wak and tanto around 4.25". My katana seems closer to 4.1", and seems hard to control on hard swings and weak to hold solidly on hard, 2 handed swings. My middle finger touches base of palm on my katana. 1/8" gap on others. What is a good way to increase grip diameter of a kat? Tennis grip? Fiberglass and resin? Friction tape? I know, I'm a dork. You mean " circumference". Diameter is the distance through something, and the circumference is the distance around it.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 4:29:36 GMT
My bad...yes Circumfrence. My machetes are all bigger gripped than 4 3/8th. My dozen tennis rackets are all bigger gripped than 4 3/8th. My wak and tanto are around 4 7/16". Why should my katana have a grip size around 4 1/4"?
|
|
|
Post by Lord Newport on Nov 5, 2020 5:22:22 GMT
My bad...yes Circumfrence. My machetes are all bigger gripped than 4 3/8th. My dozen tennis rackets are all bigger gripped than 4 3/8th. My wak and tanto are around 4 7/16". Why should my katana have a grip size around 4 1/4"? Have you been taught the correct way to grip a katana? You DO NOT grip a katana the way you would grip a machete. A machete handle has a completely different design for completely different leverage and movement than the katana. Have you found a sensei and school to teach you correctly?
|
|
|
Post by Timo Nieminen on Nov 5, 2020 8:17:49 GMT
Modern machete handles tend to be pretty fat.
IMO, 4 7/16" is far too fat for a tanto (or wakizashi), and too fat in general for a sword. I don't think I've seen an antique that fat. I measured some antiques, and many are under 4" (e.g., British P1890 = 3.75"), and some are as thin as 2.5" circumference at the fattest part of the grip (3 examples: talwar, khanda-hilted firangi, smallsword). Battleaxes can be even thinner - 2" to 2.5" isn't unusual.
|
|
|
Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Nov 5, 2020 10:09:11 GMT
You can try a wrap with tennis overgrip band. It isn't sticky except on the very ends and can be removed easily and reused a few times. I wrap most of my Euros for better and comfortable gripping. You can vary thickness and grip form with the overlap ratio. I did a wrap on a kat and I'm happy with it. Looks weird but works well.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 16:42:34 GMT
Thanks...I do wrap one of my 2 lbs machetes with tennis grip to make a comfy 4 1/2" grip. You guys are supposed to be my teacher. So..questions. Weren't our ancestors smaller than us? With smaller hands? I wear L gloves. If I were expecting battle, I'd be wearing padded, cutproof gloves already. If I were watching TV or sleeping, bare hands would be reaching for my swords...if my CZ was out of reach. That's the problem. Maybe some of us haven't envisioned the idea that situations can be different at times. I don't think we can glump a katana with a smaller EDC. Situation determine what's used. Now...for sure I would not take my gloves OFF to use my wak or tanto... Just food for thought.
|
|
|
Post by Lord Newport on Nov 5, 2020 17:02:14 GMT
Thanks...I do wrap one of my 2 lbs machetes with tennis grip to make a comfy 4 1/2" grip. You guys are supposed to be my teacher. So..questions. Weren't our ancestors smaller than us? With smaller hands? I wear L gloves. If I were expecting battle, I'd be wearing padded, cutproof gloves already. If I were watching TV or sleeping, bare hands would be reaching for my swords...if my CZ was out of reach. That's the problem. Maybe some of us haven't envisioned the idea that situations can be different at times. I don't think we can glump a katana with a smaller EDC. Situation determine what's used. Now...for sure I would not take my gloves OFF to use my wak or tanto... Just food for thought.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 17:20:21 GMT
EXACTLY! Perhaps if you guys really aren't sure, maybe one instructor stuck reliving the ancient ways might not be the best judge. I've not looking for samurai order of battle. I'm in my dreamworld where I'm awakened at night, naked and unprepared, scrambling to find the nearest hard object to keep an intruder at bay. A kat does me no good in the confines of bedroom, tv room, and connecting hallways. It's stored and locked, waiting for an unreal future situation. But it's on my mind.....hence the question. Why do kats have smaller grip circumfrence than waks and tantos?
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 17:21:50 GMT
Oh, plus maybe add more life to this forum.
|
|
|
Post by Lord Newport on Nov 5, 2020 17:33:59 GMT
If I were expecting battle, I'd be wearing padded, cutproof gloves already. Never, never ever take a sword to a gunfight ...
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 17:39:52 GMT
..and try not to match your handgun against rifles when range is involved...
|
|
|
Post by Jussi Ekholm on Nov 5, 2020 17:46:57 GMT
Can you post a picture of your katana, wakizashi and tanto?
In general size of the fittings will determine the grip size and usually larger Japanese swords will have larger fittings. There are also lot of aesthetic factors built in traditionally sizing the Japanese sword to "ideal" form.
|
|
|
Post by leed on Nov 5, 2020 18:03:53 GMT
I'm not computer literate..sorry. No gap between middle finger to base of thumb in kats. About 1/8" or a bit more on both wak and tanto. All are factory stock. That's why I was wondering about use of gloves for kat and barehanded for wak and tanto. I'd guess, if I was invited inside to eat, drink, and socialize, I'd not have gloves on. And outdoors, carrying a kat around, I'd be expecting trouble. I know, there are auditoriums and gyms big enough to allow kats. Maybe those are exceptions to any rule.
|
|
|
Post by Jussi Ekholm on Nov 5, 2020 18:15:13 GMT
Well can you tell the manufacturer / model, assuming they are production swords?
|
|
|
Post by RufusScorpius on Nov 5, 2020 19:22:34 GMT
From my research that I've done on the construction of actual katanas back in olden times, it would seem that the size of the handle was more or less custom made to the user. Hence, a samurai that wanted a larger grip would get one, if he wanted smaller grip then same thing. I would also suspect that a single samurai might have two or more sizes- one to wear around everyday and use bare hand, and another for fighting in gloves with armor on. All handles will be long enough for two hands, some being a bit more like two and a half- but generally it's two. It's the same with blade length- there is a lot of variance and the samurai would select the one that felt best for him.
Like so many other things, the most correct answer is "it depends". Katanas were hand made individually according to tradition which opens up a lot of variance in dimensions depending on era and the individual who made it. The idea of industrialized mass production according to 6 sigma standards was hundreds of years away.
Now, for a production over the shelf modern katana made in Laquan, again, it really depends. A manufacturer will have a bucket of cut blanks and then stick one on the end of a blade after wrapping it. Some might be really big, others small with most from one manufacturer being more or less the same size. My own experience indicates that there is an "about right" standard being used. I've handled some swords with a really huge grip that felt like I was gripping a tree, and others were very slim and felt almost broom handle. Most are comfortably in the center and feel generally pretty good.
I don't think there is a published standard size- if there is I would be interested in looking at it. Your best bet to find a handle that fits you is to have one made to your specifications. That's the only way to be sure (other than nuking the site from orbit...)
|
|