pgandy
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Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Oct 2, 2020 16:39:31 GMT
Nice review and welcome to the forum. That sword since they’ve come out with current edition, the first two no, but this version has been on my list. You did however, move it up a notch or two. If you want to know how the tulwar compares to other swords as in your OP I recommend any of the these three books; “Swordsmen of the British Empire”, “British Sword Fighting 1600-1945”, “Bloody Battles of the British Empire”. There’s evidently a difference in the Indian tulwar and the Afghanistan
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 17:40:09 GMT
Nice review and welcome to the forum. That sword since they’ve come out with current edition, the first two no, but this version has been on my list. You did however, move it up a notch or two. If you want to know how the tulwar compares to other swords as in your OP I recommend any of the these three books; “Swordsmen of the British Empire”, “British Sword Fighting 1600-1945”, “Bloody Battles of the British Empire”. There’s evidently a difference in the Indian tulwar and the Afghanistan Thanks! I recommended it based on its price point and availability, I’m certainly aware of its actual quality. But as this is kind of a consumer forum, we have to temper our expectations sometimes. Yeah, I compared it briefly to the Afghan pulwars only based on my speculations as I haven’t got a chance to own or even handle a pulwar. Would definitely be interested in getting my hands on one.
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 2, 2020 19:03:09 GMT
Two examples and your own opinion. I gotta get some tulwars one day...
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 19:56:09 GMT
Thanks! I recommended it based on its price point and availability, I’m certainly aware of its actual quality. But as this is kind of a consumer forum, we have to temper our expectations sometimes. Yeah, I compared it briefly to the Afghan pulwars only based on my speculations as I haven’t got a chance to own or even handle a pulwar. Would definitely be interested in getting my hands on one. Well....I own two antique tulwar/talwar and the Cold Steel is superior to both. Just Fyi. sbg-sword-forum.forums.net/thread/61493/tale-talwarsInteresting! Good to know!
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 19:57:58 GMT
Two examples and your own opinion. I gotta get some tulwars one day...
He just said "two samples" that he owns. Not sure what your opinion is. That he doesn't ACTUALLY know what he feels based on the swords he owns and handles?
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 2, 2020 20:13:57 GMT
Two examples and your own opinion. I gotta get some tulwars one day...
He just said "two samples" that he owns. Not sure what your opinion is. That he doesn't ACTUALLY know what he feels based on the swords he owns and handles? Just a jab to qualify the superficially absolute statement while poking fun, playfully, at the individual making it (who should know better) based on my own limited experience with antique weapons and their tremendous variety versus even the better modern reproductions. Oh and my distaste for the manufacturer because why not? Two examples and your own opinion. I gotta get some tulwars one day...
No, trust me.. you would think it was superior to both lol I remember the thread and by that recollection I feel inclined to agree, but that's not to say individual preference marks superior reproduction.
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 20:41:00 GMT
He just said "two samples" that he owns. Not sure what your opinion is. That he doesn't ACTUALLY know what he feels based on the swords he owns and handles? Just a jab to qualify the superficially absolute statement while poking fun, playfully, at the individual making it (who should know better) based on my own limited experience with antique weapons and their tremendous variety versus even the better modern reproductions. Oh and my distaste for the manufacturer because why not? No, trust me.. you would think it was superior to both lol I remember the thread and by that recollection I feel inclined to agree, but that's not to say individual preference marks superior reproduction. OK, that's literally an admission of your bias. In this case, it's almost unfounded, as CS isn't even a manufacturer. They are just a marketer and reseller. If you are to pass the judgement, you'll have to judge case by case.
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 2, 2020 20:47:17 GMT
I have admitted my bias against Cold Steel products, all of their manufacturers included, many times. It does come from some personal experience. But that's not even the point I'm making. My point is what you said last: Judge case-by-case. Don't go thinking that if you buy the Cold Steel tulwar that you're getting a better sword than if you buy a good antique. You're probably not.
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 20:53:05 GMT
I have admitted my bias against Cold Steel products, all of their manufacturers included, many times. It does come from some personal experience. But that's not even the point I'm making. My point is what you said last: Judge case-by-case. Don't go thinking that if you buy the Cold Steel tulwar that you're getting a better sword than if you buy a good antique. You're probably not. Nobody said that. Somebody: "OK, here are the reproduction and antique samples I own, and here are my opinions." You: "These are just stuff you own and your opinions!!!! GOTCHA!!!" Sir, you have surely, got him. And BTW, these are not even reproductions, tulwars are just modern swords, they've never really stopped the production of tulwars. This one isn't a reproduction of an archaeological find or something.
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 2, 2020 21:16:19 GMT
RN, just curious but what exactly would you expect to see in a " good antique tulwar" that would be superior to the Cold Steel? Like what features, specifically. And second question: These features that would make it clearly superior, how common are they in examples? Honestly? I dunno. I just made a light-hearted comment suggesting wide variance not only in antique examples but in specific production models and encouraging others to explore more before deciding and whatever this is happened. It's all beyond me at this point.
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 21:50:13 GMT
Honestly? I dunno. I just made a light-hearted comment suggesting wide variance not only in antique examples but in specific production models and encouraging others to explore more before deciding and whatever this is happened. It's all beyond me at this point. I didn't take it the wrong way or anything I know we make jabs on here all the time lol I was just wondering out of pure curiosity because it's sort of a unique class of sword with so much variance that I am not sure what exactly would be a superior tulwar to the CS. I mean Good quality blade, check. Good quality and proper construction, check. Nice distal taper and balance, check. Plausible historical design and materials, check. 🤷My guess is his criteria for being superior is “Not being sold by CS”.
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 2, 2020 21:54:56 GMT
RN, just curious but what exactly would you expect to see in a " good antique tulwar" that would be superior to the Cold Steel? Like what features, specifically. And second question: These features that would make it clearly superior, how common are they in examples? Honestly? I dunno. I just made a light-hearted comment suggesting wide variance not only in antique examples but in specific production models and encouraging others to explore more before deciding and whatever this is happened. It's all beyond me at this point. I actually have no problem with that statement. Antiques by definition share no common characteristics other than being old, and maybe being somewhat rare.
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 2, 2020 22:01:46 GMT
My whole thing was, basically, just because a modern repro fits an individual's (or even a group's) preference better than a small sample of antiques doesn't mean it's a better representation of the type than the antiques. Well-made modern repro versus poorly-made antiques? Repro meant to handle well for modern, western fencing styles versus old swords made for a specific system of combat in their native environment? Context in comparison? Not saying the CS isn't a great sword. Saying it may or may not be a good representation of characteristics desired in a tulwar, for the fighting systems used by those who originally weilded tulwars in their native warfare. But being made by Cold Steel makes anything a stinky-pile-o'-poo.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Oct 3, 2020 17:01:45 GMT
Technically being made of tempered springy metal makes the CS better than any I have, which are not spoingy spoingy bendy.
Hope I get a CS in my 20 sabres arriving Wednesday... lol.
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 3, 2020 20:47:39 GMT
Maybe they're not supposed to be spoingy spoingy bendy. Maybe that's wrong. Maybe I'm just being facetious.
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Oct 4, 2020 0:18:32 GMT
I think my worst-handling antique sword has a similar POB and weight. A late Qing cavalry dao, IIRC POB at 9", 1.3kg. Not a pleasant sword to swing. Cavalry swords usually are forward balanced. But 9” is quite extreme. Matt Easton reviewed an LK Chen Han Dynasty Cavalry Dao replica. Must be vastly different from a later period Dao, but must it still has a PoB at 9”-10”. Matt reports that the handling of the sword makes you want to put it down. My LK Chen Heavenly Horse dao balances at a bit over 10". But it's very light, especially for its immense length, and is a fun thing to swing around. I have other lightweight swords with POB at about 8" or so, which have a somewhat similar feel. A far-out POB due to a lightweight hilt doesn't make the sword harder to swing than it would be with the same blade and a heavier hilt.
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Oct 4, 2020 0:30:12 GMT
what exactly would you expect to see in a " good antique tulwar" that would be superior to the Cold Steel? The CS looks like a good cavalry-style talwar. One might find an antique cavalry talwar that is a little better for one's own taste in handling and size, and size/stlye of grip (e.g., shorter or longer grip, bigger disc, no knucklebow). Also prettier antiques. But one can easily find worse antiques, too. For use on foot, something lighter and thinner near the point can be better. But that's along the lines of saying "a smallsword is superior to a cavalry sword".
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 4, 2020 16:55:42 GMT
Cavalry swords usually are forward balanced. But 9” is quite extreme. Matt Easton reviewed an LK Chen Han Dynasty Cavalry Dao replica. Must be vastly different from a later period Dao, but must it still has a PoB at 9”-10”. Matt reports that the handling of the sword makes you want to put it down. My LK Chen Heavenly Horse dao balances at a bit over 10". But it's very light, especially for its immense length, and is a fun thing to swing around. I have other lightweight swords with POB at about 8" or so, which have a somewhat similar feel. A far-out POB due to a lightweight hilt doesn't make the sword harder to swing than it would be with the same blade and a heavier hilt. Yeah Chinese swords from antiquity are generally light weight but blade heavy compared to later period swords due to the absence of weighty pommels and guards. I gotta admit my personally preference of throw the cut with rotation from the wrist makes me hate blade heavy swords, even light-weight ones. But i have to get my hands on a Heavenly Horse to say for sure.
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Post by Kane Shen on Oct 4, 2020 16:59:55 GMT
Maybe they're not supposed to be spoingy spoingy bendy. Maybe that's wrong. Maybe I'm just being facetious. CS sabres are not springy, but some of them have inadequate distal tapers, which makes them handle worse than antique originals. But I guess this is too much information for you, as you just want the world to know of your hatred of CS as much as those militant vegans who totally want to slaughter Lynn Thompson for slicing up pig carcasses.🙃 Am I right?
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Post by randomnobody on Oct 5, 2020 0:07:31 GMT
No.
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