Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2020 2:14:02 GMT
I apologize for rough housing.
If I had not included a question mark, it certainly could have been construed as condescending.
"You get context and the general use of "fun" and "speculating" and know my meaning. And if you don't then that may well be the issue."
It appears to be your issue.
Cheers GC
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Post by howler on Aug 6, 2020 2:35:29 GMT
I apologize for rough housing. If I had not included a question mark, it certainly could have been construed as condescending. "You get context and the general use of "fun" and "speculating" and know my meaning. And if you don't then that may well be the issue." It appears to be your issue. Cheers GC Well, if you are talking about the ^ symbol than those are very functional roofs. Hmm, if I added a question mark to smug, arrogant, condescending, grumpy, a hole...etc...in addressing one of your posts than a mulligan is somehow achieved? Well, yes, it is (for me) a very big issue if you construe the words "fun" and "speculating" into a meaning where clearly none was meant. To be clear, the fun is in talking (sure, I guess this includes speculating) with people (many I have now quasi known for years) on this forum and elsewhere, and yes, this actually often includes you. Again, the whole thing is nothing but a chicken wing, and I'll further endeavor to post more current from AP or wherever. See, ya got me so nervous now I don't want to get the famous Edelweiss shiv. Ouch.
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Post by Lord Newport on Aug 6, 2020 3:40:27 GMT
I offered all a live feed of the most recent articles, gathered rather locally. You seem to be hung up on the fireworks, when I referred to your not knowing the ammonium nitrate had certainly not been forgotten (which you had posted that the storage had been forgotten). Those are posts you quoted, I assume you may have read them. To me howler, your words pretty much speak for themselves. "The latest would simply be saying "latest info is that fireworks were not involved." Again, you seem hung up on your fireworks mention instead of your knowledge regarding the storage. "I use "fun speculating" in a clearly very general sense and you're well intelligent enough to know this, unless you truly believe I'm intentionally mocking the dead, which highlights my only disagreement with you in labeling me clueless." I tend to take your thoughts at face value. Cheers GC I grant my mistake was going off of an older AP, but really, the main thing was that you have near 300 freaking tons of explosive stored at such a place for six years without proper safety measures. My issue was in nature of dialogue with (to me) condescending "clueless" statement rather than simply stating that explosives were not forgotten and fireworks not stored in location (or old AP story or whatever). I'm not gonna die or ask you to stand in the field of battle with one of your spadroons in hand, but feel why the need to be needlessly (my opinion anyway) negative. You get context and the general use of "fun" and "speculating" and know my meaning. And if you don't then that may well be the issue. just for the record.... Prime Minister Hassan Diab said that 2,750 metric tons of ammonium nitrate -- typically used as an agricultural fertilizer -- had been stored for six years at a warehouse in the Beirut port without safety measures,
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Post by howler on Aug 6, 2020 4:48:15 GMT
I grant my mistake was going off of an older AP, but really, the main thing was that you have near 300 freaking tons of explosive stored at such a place for six years without proper safety measures. My issue was in nature of dialogue with (to me) condescending "clueless" statement rather than simply stating that explosives were not forgotten and fireworks not stored in location (or old AP story or whatever). I'm not gonna die or ask you to stand in the field of battle with one of your spadroons in hand, but feel why the need to be needlessly (my opinion anyway) negative. You get context and the general use of "fun" and "speculating" and know my meaning. And if you don't then that may well be the issue. just for the record.... Prime Minister Hassan Diab said that 2,750 metric tons of ammonium nitrate -- typically used as an agricultural fertilizer -- had been stored for six years at a warehouse in the Beirut port without safety measures, Yikes, which explains the lagoon/crater.
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Post by Dandelion on Aug 6, 2020 4:52:44 GMT
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Post by Dandelion on Aug 6, 2020 5:10:03 GMT
Baaad stuff... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_nitrate_disasterWhat reads strange to me and instantly feels idiotic: "Belgium/Tessenderlo April 29, 1942: An attempt to disaggregate a pile of 150 tonnes of ammonium nitrate with industrial explosives killed 189 people and wounded another 900" There are SOME entries with actions like this described here; what were they thinking that would happen? O.o
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Post by MOK on Aug 6, 2020 14:02:02 GMT
Just to clarify a point that keeps coming up, ammonium nitrate is not an actual explosive, let alone a high explosive. It's a common fertilizer that's also used as a raw material for a certain type of explosives and can under fairly specific circumstances be explosively combustible in its own right.
(There's actually a whole lot of that kind of stuff involved in most industries, stuff that's somewhat dangerous to store in large quantities but useful enough that it's still regularly stockpiled. If anything, it's a small wonder this type of thing doesn't happen more often.)
Which is also where the speculation about fireworks came from, AIUI: this stuff isn't inherently explosive on its own, so something besides a huge pile of it sitting abandoned in a warehouse has to have gone wrong for it to actually go off like this. It seems that for the moment everyone in a position to find out is leaning towards incompetence rather than malice, though, so there's your silver lining for today's storm cloud...
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Post by MOK on Aug 6, 2020 14:08:21 GMT
Baaad stuff... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_nitrate_disasterWhat reads strange to me and instantly feels idiotic: "Belgium/Tessenderlo April 29, 1942: An attempt to disaggregate a pile of 150 tonnes of ammonium nitrate with industrial explosives killed 189 people and wounded another 900" There are SOME entries with actions like this described here; what were they thinking that would happen? O.o These are mostly attempts at controlled demolition. Much like deliberately detonating a bomb somewhere safe, clearing brush by burning to prevent uncontrollable wildfires, or letting a fire hazard building burn down in a contained way. Sometimes people - even perfectly competent people! - make mistakes, and it goes wrong.
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Post by RufusScorpius on Aug 6, 2020 14:10:27 GMT
It certainly looks like gross incompetence coupled with a lack of safety culture. Events like this are then end result of a CHAIN of events that all add up. Individually, each part is not a problem, but added together equals disaster.
The investigation will take quite a long time. The Lebanese government has put the local politicians and Port Authority officers under house arrest because some of them were trying to leave the country. At least this shows they are taking this very seriously.
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