Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 5, 2019 16:24:01 GMT
From what I understand the buckler is kinda held out on the side, and covers the center and Shield arm side, while the sword covers the sword arm side and people typically evade, for strikes done at the legs, unlike buckler where the buckler is held right in front of you with a central cone of defense.
Both typically tend to follow the sword, but the basket hilt doesn't need the same defense an arming sword does
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 5, 2019 17:39:52 GMT
I have found a few good good channels. One in particular is the Cateran Society. They have some decent philosophy, drills, and sparring videos. I'll try find a link when I'm done school, if you haven't already found them by then
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 5, 2019 17:58:32 GMT
The earlier videos have targe instructions. They are quite good
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Post by Cosmoline on Sept 10, 2019 19:00:26 GMT
In my experience sparring against arm-strapped shields, they are able to deliver stronger displacements than the buckler but are less useful at longer measure. As with larger strapped shields, you are best off getting a separation at long measure and hitting the exposed wrist. Overbinds or arm wraps just don't work as well because they have the leverage advantage close in.
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Post by leviathansteak on Sept 11, 2019 8:38:35 GMT
This is from my hema club. The person with the rotella is of buhurt background with several years of experience.
The buckler guy has over 30 years experience in areas including chanbara, sport fencing and hema.
I'll let you watch the outcome
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Sept 11, 2019 14:13:30 GMT
Thanks for sharing the video.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Sept 11, 2019 17:23:12 GMT
Gosh, the guy with the rotella is getting torn apart in that video.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Sept 11, 2019 20:33:34 GMT
Several years experience ≠ 30 years experience. Also the fellow with the rotella appears to be tiring during the later part and is not holding his shield as high as in the beginning resulting in him receiving some strikes. I think that is the major difference between the two. Could be body condition and/or heavier shield.
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Post by Cosmoline on Sept 11, 2019 21:37:09 GMT
In my experience sparring against arm-strapped shields, they are able to deliver stronger displacements than the buckler but are less useful at longer measure. As with larger strapped shields, you are best off getting a separation at long measure and hitting the exposed wrist. Overbinds or arm wraps just don't work as well because they have the leverage advantage close in. So do you consider either weapon to have a considerable advantage over the other? Its an interesting match up. It's a toss up. I'd rather have my buckler because I like being able to use it further out. Arm straps give you stronger leverage close in, but you don't have as many options in general. You can't just drop them if grabbed and you can't do hand grabs as easily when you're tied to one.
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Post by paulmuaddib on Sept 11, 2019 22:38:09 GMT
Also I think the “guy” with the shield is a gal. Less upper body strength for holding up a heavier shield.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Sept 12, 2019 2:01:30 GMT
Since you mentioned it I believe so. Perhaps leviathansteak will put some words around that.
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Post by leviathansteak on Sept 12, 2019 2:16:01 GMT
Yea the rotella user is a lady. I understand she uses sword and shield in buhurt so she should be used to it.
I have used a buckler against a rotella and you can make do with a smaller shield if your technical skill is better. Your cuts are less restricted by your smaller shield.
When using a large shield. Blocking with the shield is easy due to the size but im more used to a buckler and sometimes obstruct my vision with the shield or smack my own head when raising it. Whoops.
So i guess its a matter of whether you want more defensive (targe/rotella) or offensive (buckler) capability.
Id choose a rotella if my life depended on it but go for a buckler for an edc kind of thing
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 12, 2019 2:51:47 GMT
Yea the rotella user is a lady. I understand she uses sword and shield in buhurt so she should be used to it. I have used a buckler against a rotella and you can make do with a smaller shield if your technical skill is better. Your cuts are less restricted by your smaller shield. When using a large shield. Blocking with the shield is easy due to the size but im more used to a buckler and sometimes obstruct my vision with the shield or smack my own head when raising it. Whoops. So i guess its a matter of whether you want more defensive (targe/rotella) or offensive (buckler) capability. Id choose a rotella if my life depended on it but go for a buckler for an edc kind of thing The thing I love about targe is its not a very big shield. It's quite easy to move around it. Since you got a basket hilt with it, it enables you to have a less protective guard, and more mobility. John, that is an excellent video. Thanks for posting it
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Post by leviathansteak on Sept 12, 2019 3:43:23 GMT
How big is an average targe? That rotella is 24 inches in diameter and quite a handful to lug around if im not expecting a fight
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 12, 2019 3:52:02 GMT
How big is an average targe? That rotella is 24 inches in diameter and quite a handful to lug around if im not expecting a fight Covers the forarm, typically. Some go slightly short of it, and some go slightly past it
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Post by leviathansteak on Sept 12, 2019 6:57:05 GMT
Oh that sounds smaller than what i expected. If i were to use a shield of that size id rather have it boss held like a big buckler
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 12, 2019 7:08:15 GMT
Oh that sounds smaller than what i expected. If i were to use a shield of that size id rather have it boss held like a big buckler It's balanced by a basket hilt. It can come a lot larger too, but from what I've seen, that is the typical size. Check out the YouTube link I described earlier. See what you think after it
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Post by leviathansteak on Sept 12, 2019 7:37:41 GMT
I guess the system makes sense. Since youve got the basket hilt, your hand can come forward and doesnt need to hide behind the buckler.
And since you likewise don't have to extend the shield out to cover the hand, you might as well have it arm strapped where its more manageable.
Pretty cool
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 12, 2019 7:42:45 GMT
I guess the system makes sense. Since youve got the basket hilt, your hand can come forward and doesnt need to hide behind the buckler. And since you likewise don't have to extend the shield out to cover the hand, you might as well have it arm strapped where its more manageable. Pretty cool It's not the worst system. I think it's quite balanced as far as trade offs go, especially with a straight blade basket hilt
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Sept 12, 2019 14:08:55 GMT
It's balanced by a basket hilt. It can come a lot larger too, but from what I've seen, that is the typical size. Check out the YouTube link I described earlier. See what you think after it This one? That's the one. He has very good videos on it
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