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Post by johntaylor879 on Apr 9, 2019 10:26:23 GMT
It's not completely out of the blue..
There were big issues about a year ago, some rumblings recently - and now its hit with a SLAM - our own version of Brexit but with swords..
There's no explanation, but now ALL USPS shipments of Swords to Europe are being rejected - and it's not just swords coming from the USA, shipments from China have ALSO been halted and returned to sender (and that means, many will disappear in the black hole that is Shanghai customs).
Sword sellers all over the place are getting hit by this and losing shipments and taking hard hits in the process - and there are no workarounds left it would seem..
So without explanation, and regardless that swords are legal to own for collectors in most of Europe, it seems that you guys over there just had your rights to import swords clipped without recourse..
We will keep you updated of the situation as it becomes clearer - in the meantime if any European customers have any additional info please share with the community in this thread..
In the interim, we too have taken some hard hits with wasted shipping and now are attempting to clean up the mess the E.U. has gifted us all and like many other sellers, have no choice but to halt all European orders across all sword lines until the situation becomes clearer one way or the other..
Here is where we are at now - from an already much shorter dropdown list for shipping options and now, just 10..
Not fun going over the whole store and striking down what was already a minority of our products. The golden age of sword collecting is most definitely far behind us...
The ONLY option on the table still left (if you can really call it an option)..
While USPS and all China based shipments are currently impossible, at the time of writing this post Fed Ex and DHL are still sometimes accepting sword shipments.. Unfortunately, starting at around $180 per sword, its pretty much a mute point - and no matter which way you look at it, European Sword Collectors have just been delivered a knockout punch..
The ONLY winners here are EU based sword sellers - as they can still import in bulk (as far as I know) and now with no international competition, can charge prices even HIGHER than they already are.. Just 1000 Euros for a Hanwei Practical Katana might soon be a bargain..
Let's do what we can to understand and defeat this stupidity.. The floor is open (and lets try to avoid too much political discussion - though we do understand if in this situation, it's a bit hard to avoid..)
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Post by johntaylor879 on Apr 9, 2019 10:32:33 GMT
I have just joined the forum so hopefully I can enlighten our less restricted cousins on ways around the EU import restrictions, provided you know what the restrictions are.
The EU has a customs union for all member states, and all members have to enforce the joint importation rules. Members can add local restrictions if they want to, but they can’t take anything away.
From time to time EU Members identify heightened risks or fashion trends in weapons, so they bring in laws to ban the ownership of them. This has happened, in the UK, with self-loading guns, switch blades, lock knives, throwing stars, flare pistols, mace, stun guns, curved blades, and now so called ‘zombie slayers’, or fantasy swords as we know them. All banned weapons are put on a proscribed customs list that, at best, prevents their importation and, at worst, could involve a visit from 5-0!
However, there are exceptions to every rule, so approved organisations, clubs, and their members can legally own and buy some of the proscribed weapons. These groups include museums, theatrical suppliers, military, police and security, licenced resellers, martial arts, LARPS, and war gamers.
The only way for these people to buy from outside the EU without trouble is to get an import licence and send copies to the seller. The seller should attach copies to the shipping manifest and the package where they can be easily read at customs control. There may be a requirement for the buyer to personally collect the item from customs as there are, in the UK anyway, further restrictions on door deliveries and proof of age.
To get an import licence, the buyer may have to prove to customs that they are a bona-fide approved organisation member, and that they have a legitimate reason for owning the item.
My suggestion to overseas sellers is to sell through in-country resellers who can get a blanket import licence for business use. Two in the UK might be Nine Circles for martial weapons, and Southern Swords for most other edged weapons, but there may be others.
One other consideration is that traditionally made swords and vintage firearms are generally exempt (so far) from the blanket ban, but it would be extremely hard to convince customs at the point of entry!
WRT to air transportation, Air Transport Safety Boards produce a list of dangerous items and restrictions on their carriage, either in cabin or in hold, and the aircraft loadmaster has to abide by them. Best go on the airline’s website if you want to check up on that. For example, no blade can be carried in a cabin, but a transport aircraft is all cabin, depending on how you look at it...
I know that this doesn’t make selling and importation easy, but at least it’s not impossible for the right people.
Sent from my iPad
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Post by Siward on Apr 9, 2019 13:02:28 GMT
Thanks for the long post, most informative.
You’re not correct on the legal position, in the UK at least, of owning and importing from outside Europe.
A distinction needs to be made between katanas etc... with curved blades which the legislation then ties on additional criteria on what is considered legal vs European swords which are generally speaking straight.
Even under the new legislation going through parliament now, European swords are legal to both own and import.
Mind you, that’s not to say some over zealous customs person won’t block or reject any importation.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 16:42:00 GMT
Thanks for the long post, most informative. You’re not correct on the legal position, in the UK at least, of owning and importing from outside Europe. A distinction needs to be made between katanas etc... with curved blades which the legislation then ties on additional criteria on what is considered legal vs European swords which are generally speaking straight. Even under the new legislation going through parliament now, European swords are legal to both own and import. Mind you, that’s not to say some over zealous customs person won’t block or reject any importation. It is and stays nonsense. Just not true. I just received a sword from Nepal (obviously non EU), one is on its way from China, and one i got from Norway (which also is not EU while being right in the middle). Also i ordered one from KOA via Shipito; we will see how that works out. When the swords from China and US arrive, i will post the customs/shipping documents here. |
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Post by csills2313 on Apr 9, 2019 17:23:45 GMT
The swords That I have purchased from China were declared as training swords
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Post by strigoil on Apr 9, 2019 19:19:21 GMT
Thanks for the long post, most informative. You’re not correct on the legal position, in the UK at least, of owning and importing from outside Europe. A distinction needs to be made between katanas etc... with curved blades which the legislation then ties on additional criteria on what is considered legal vs European swords which are generally speaking straight. Even under the new legislation going through parliament now, European swords are legal to both own and import. Mind you, that’s not to say some over zealous customs person won’t block or reject any importation. It is and stays nonsense. Just not true. I just received a sword from Nepal (obviously non EU), one is on its way from China, and one i got from Norway (which also is not EU while being right in the middle). Also i ordered one from KOA via Shipito; we will see how that works out. When the swords from China and US arrive, i will post the customs/shipping documents here.
"I don't have a problem so there is no problem"
For you to state that it's not true and is nonsense, just because you haven't had any problems (yet) is simply ignorant.
Also the UK issues with importing curved swords is very much true, and not nonsense.
In Norway we have no laws or regulation on swords, didn't stop chinese customs from rejecting the same sword 6 times for me in 2017 before the seller and me finally agreed to refund.
I haven't received anything from the US since early 2018 so can't speak for how that goes here, but most shippers end up using UPS to ship to me anyway, so no change for me really.
My personal theory is it is purely a carrier issue and not a problem with EU law or individual European countries laws, it should have had a much more consistent impact across carriers and countries if that was the case.
But really, you need to stop this eagerness to prove nothing is wrong, it's just silly when clearly there is.
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Post by pellius on Apr 9, 2019 20:37:37 GMT
Strigoil - nicely stated.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 21:33:42 GMT
Sooo...
I have a different opinion to this matter - you shut me up.
I offered to post different facts and proof - you cut me short.
I think its time to leave - you certainly AGREE!
This whole affair stinks. I dont know what the point could be in putting up such a RUMOR - and nothing more it is - but i dont care anymore. You US guys obiously know EVERYTHING about how EU legal systems work; so be it. But... it all crumbles down under some facts:
* shipping with any company besides USPS works just fine
* shipping from other countries besides the US works just fine
IF there would be an existing "sword ban":
* shipping/importing swords to Europe wouldnt work at all
* authorities like customs offices should be aware of and informed on the matter
Have a good time then, you all. Maybe i will be back some time later. Maybe not. I doubt anybody cares anyway.
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Post by strigoil on Apr 9, 2019 21:53:55 GMT
Sooo... I have a different opinion to this matter - you shut me up. I offered to post different facts and proof - you cut me short. I think its time to leave - you certainly AGREE! This whole affair stinks. I dont know what the point could be in putting up such a RUMOR - and nothing more it is - but i dont care anymore. You US guys obiously know EVERYTHING about how EU legal systems work; so be it. But... it all crumbles down under some facts: * shipping with any company besides USPS works just fine * shipping from other countries besides the US works just fine IF there would be an existing "sword ban": * shipping/importing swords to Europe wouldnt work at all * authorities like customs offices should be aware of and informed on the matter Have a good time then, you all. Maybe i will be back some time later. Maybe not. I doubt anybody cares anyway.
I'm European, Norwegian to be exact, like I stated. No need to get so heated.
And if you are getting your swords no problem, that is great for you, the only point I was trying to make, and which you consistently seem to refuse to let sink in is that your experience is not the same everyone else has, there IS a problem, we're not exactly sure what is causing it, that you are having no issues with this so far is fantastic, but a lot are having problems, wherever the fault lies. so it's not nonsense, as you claim.
I personally think you are too quick to anger and take things personal, but if you want to leave that's your choice, see you on another account, Holg.
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Post by pellius on Apr 9, 2019 21:57:52 GMT
strigoil - nicely stated, again
oldvesemir - no offense intended
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Apr 9, 2019 22:40:06 GMT
Sooo... I have a different opinion to this matter - you shut me up. I offered to post different facts and proof - you cut me short. I think its time to leave - you certainly AGREE! This whole affair stinks. I dont know what the point could be in putting up such a RUMOR - and nothing more it is - but i dont care anymore. You US guys obiously know EVERYTHING about how EU legal systems work; so be it. But... it all crumbles down under some facts: * shipping with any company besides USPS works just fine * shipping from other countries besides the US works just fine IF there would be an existing "sword ban": * shipping/importing swords to Europe wouldnt work at all * authorities like customs offices should be aware of and informed on the matter Have a good time then, you all. Maybe i will be back some time later. Maybe not. I doubt anybody cares anyway. Might as well stay dude. There's other reasons to stay. Once in a while I find myself in heated arguments here too. I find taking a few days away from the forum tends to help a bit. There seems to be a bias here, and rules get bent in favour of those biases. That's bullsh*t in my opinion but I still like a lot of people here. There are some good people on this forum. You might miss some of them |
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Post by zabazagobo on Apr 9, 2019 23:48:48 GMT
Sooo... I have a different opinion to this matter - you shut me up. I offered to post different facts and proof - you cut me short. I think its time to leave - you certainly AGREE! This whole affair stinks. I dont know what the point could be in putting up such a RUMOR - and nothing more it is - but i dont care anymore. You US guys obiously know EVERYTHING about how EU legal systems work; so be it. But... it all crumbles down under some facts: * shipping with any company besides USPS works just fine * shipping from other countries besides the US works just fine IF there would be an existing "sword ban": * shipping/importing swords to Europe wouldnt work at all * authorities like customs offices should be aware of and informed on the matter Have a good time then, you all. Maybe i will be back some time later. Maybe not. I doubt anybody cares anyway. It is pretty much just a rumor. Painting things as being EU specific was wrong. Just as saying a year or two ago that shipping direct from China was going to be universally impossible a few years ago was wrong. There was no China shipping ban.. There is no EU sword ban. There is an issue with EMS and USPS and customs and postage with certain countries. It's a postage issue that is hot n cold and case specific. It varies by country. Germany is pretty chill. The U.K. is in the middle of Brexit, so who knows what's going on with them any given day of the month.
How you (and others) have had no recent problems just demonstrates that it is highly case specific. I think it's been established that the notion of an "EU Sword Ban/Swexit" has been factually debunked sufficiently.
For me, it seems logical that declaring parcels "fencing equipment", "sporting goods", "training/practice swords" whatever would appease customs officials in most parts of the civilized world where swords are legal. Always worked for me in the past.
Anything otherwise is worth looking into and plain odd. I think we agree on these fronts.
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Post by jounij on Apr 10, 2019 6:10:21 GMT
Finnish customs customer service was contacted concerning the issue. They told that there are no new regulations concerning of importing sharp blades. It seems that this is indeed mostly courier issue.
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Apr 11, 2019 20:53:07 GMT
@oldvesemir: You should post that you just got a ZT Deuce from the US, showing that they apparently have no problem shipping to Germany.
I don't know what this is but it's not transparent, that's for sure.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 21:16:58 GMT
@oldvesemir : You should post that you just got a ZT Deuce from the US, showing that they apparently have no problem shipping to Germany. I don't know what this is but it's not transparent, that's for sure. Ah, you know, i dont really care anymore... "Schteige mer doch ind' Dasch!" before "d' Gosch franslig schwätze"... ;-) Besides that, it is in the NewAq thread. |
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Post by admin on Apr 12, 2019 4:37:39 GMT
Well, it is still hurting us pretty badly at SBG - just lost $150 in shipping with two more returns from Europe -items refused by customs as 'dangerous goods'..
We are paying all the refunds in full to customers out of our pockets when they are pretty darned shallow right now.. So essentially, USPS is out as a shipping option to Europe now and hitting a brick wall at customs.
Unfortunately for SBG, we ship from so many locations that it's impossible to get our online system to handle the different possibilities for pricing. With USPS we could charge a flat rate of $60 and the costs would be something like $63 to $85, so we just absorbed the difference. With couriers, it could be almost anything - so we can only proceed on a quote by quote basis and cannot process the order via the store.
Nasty, ongoing pain for most vendors I believe (or customers if they bought from a company not willing to do the right thing)...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 5:59:09 GMT
"USPS is out as a shipping option to Europe now and hitting a brick wall at customs" Please, may i KINDLY and CALMLY ask from which country the returns came back? From which countries customs? Because again: there is no such thing as a central european customs authority. A USPS shipment to Germany for example will arrive most likely at Frankfurt airport. There we have the main german customs authority for air freight traffic. A shipment via ship to germany for example would be processed via Hamburg port customs. I think it is important to put out that theres not a general problem with shipping to Europe but maybe to certain countries. You pointed out yourself that other couriers work fine - and thats the truth. UPS, FedEx... no problems. So, that rules out a general customs issue, right? Because, no matter if its delivered to Germany by IPS, FedEx, TNT, whatever... the shipment HAS to go through customs. The couriers declare and process the stuff themselves with customs and therefore want quite some more money from you, but the goods GO THROUGH CUSTOMS. I am a 100% sure by now that this is a declaration problem; Zombie Tools for example says: "listing the blade as a *handmade custom* and removing the word *Zombie* for all paperwork has worked for us". This is exactly what i usuall ask for when ordering a sword from the US, private or vendor: "movie replica", "fantasy replica", "antique replica" etc. etc. OF COURSE the word "sword" should be avoided, no doubt there! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 6:27:55 GMT
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Post by Jordan Williams on Apr 12, 2019 6:30:42 GMT
"USPS is out as a shipping option to Europe now and hitting a brick wall at customs" Please, may i KINDLY and CALMLY ask from which country the returns came back? From which countries customs? Because again: there is no such thing as a central european customs authority. A USPS shipment to Germany for example will arrive most likely at Frankfurt airport. There we have the main german customs authority for air freight traffic. A shipment via ship to germany for example would be processed via Hamburg port customs. I think it is important to put out that theres not a general problem with shipping to Europe but maybe to certain countries. You pointed out yourself that other couriers work fine - and thats the truth. UPS, FedEx... no problems. So, that rules out a general customs issue, right? Because, no matter if its delivered to Germany by IPS, FedEx, TNT, whatever... the shipment HAS to go through customs. The couriers declare and process the stuff themselves with customs and therefore want quite some more money from you, but the goods GO THROUGH CUSTOMS. I am a 100% sure by now that this is a declaration problem; Zombie Tools for example says: "listing the blade as a *handmade custom* and removing the word *Zombie* for all paperwork has worked for us". This is exactly what i usuall ask for when ordering a sword from the US, private or vendor: "movie replica", "fantasy replica", "antique replica" etc. etc. OF COURSE the word "sword" should be avoided, no doubt there! I'm curious Holg, what's the issue you have here? Clearly USPS is not working out as a shipping company for the SBG store when shipping to Europe. Do you have reason to believe that's a lie? "The word sword should be avoided", eh, They are swords being shipped no? There is obviously at the moment not a black and white clear reason for these troubles, and your ranting comments really don't make much sense, at least to me. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 7:08:26 GMT
OK.
First: I just received a shipment from ZT via USPS
Second: a sword from China has just past customs and its on its way to me
third: if THIS, or my above post is a rant - then goodbye!
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