Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 9:12:23 GMT
At the moment I have a really thick targe paired with a heavy short sword as my main combo. It's been slowly winning me over, competing with saber. But my only complaint is that I find them to be a bit sluggish.
I know most speed comes from foot work, but what are some exercises I can do with my shield and sword? I would like to build me strength specifically for using them effectively. I lack confidence most especially in the acceleration of my sword.
I could employ weights to help me with this, but what sort of training do you think would help me build the strength to effectively use the combo, using the sword and shield itself?
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jan 10, 2019 13:49:57 GMT
I have a Windlass shield that I found a bit heavy. I think they designed it to hold up for someone to re-enact with on a routine basis. It weighs about 9 lb. which I found slow and tiring to handle so a made a round one at about 5 lb. that I find much faster and does not tax my endurance. I suspect that it will hold together for one good fight but robust was not in the planning. I have several swords that will make it a good companion and all are in the neighbourhood of 2-2½ lbs. I found that practicing with swords heavier than I intend to use helped to build my strength. For instance I do (did) my PT with a 4.7 lb w/sheath bastard sword using one hand. I need to get back to my PT which has slipped lately, I do it for a day or two then stop. Shame on me.
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Post by markus313 on Jan 10, 2019 14:57:15 GMT
I find that the best „strength“ training for sword (and shield) usage is training with the sword (and shield). Just going through the motion repeatedly and perhaps striking the heavy bag (if you have a blunt). Otherwise nowadays my PT consists of exercises for muscular/skeletal alignment, mainly, like TRX rows, squats, presses etc. No heavy work. Like in other ma, joining/programming/timing the cns/musculature/fascia is key, or as some like to call it, working towards a dynamic mind-body connection.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 16:16:15 GMT
What if all I have is a sharp? I don't think I could even find a properly weighted blunt for a training that's even similar to my TFW Danu. It's not unwieldy but it's more sluggish in the cut than I would be comfortable using, hypothetically, against another swordsman.
Is there any good videos you guys know of?
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jan 10, 2019 17:28:07 GMT
You might search YouTube for a tutorial. “Pell” is a search word, there are others. Matt Easton has a brief one involving a sabre in one of his videos. Like Markus said “Just going through the motion repeatedly”. A pell would help. Unfortunately I have none and just cut air which can lead to bad things if not careful. I practiced with escrima sticks fanning air because I had nothing better. Then the day came that I could target a bag and there was all the difference in the world. Ditto for nunchakus using a banana tree and found that those things can kick back. I thought that I had broken my thumb the first time. In short there is no one way to train but a variety will be more meaningful.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 17:45:39 GMT
You might search YouTube for a tutorial. “Pell” is a search word, there are others. Matt Easton has a brief one involving a sabre in one of his videos. Like Markus said “Just going through the motion repeatedly”. A pell would help. Unfortunately I have none and just cut air which can lead to bad things if not careful. I practiced with escrima sticks fanning air because I had nothing better. Then the day came that I could target a bag and there was all the difference in the world. Ditto for nunchakus using a banana tree and found that those things can kick back. I thought that I had broken my thumb the first time. In short there is no one way to train but a variety will be more meaningful. Unfortunately, I don't think I could own a Pell for a long time. A pity, really. Plus all I have is a sharp sword. Not sure if they make short heavy blunts anywhere. Perhaps I'll try my hand at making one someday
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 17:48:34 GMT
I know my buddy recently got new tires so maybe he will let me have one of his old ones. It's bald anyway. And if I can get a rough handle shape on a bit of leaf spring, that might do the trick.
This might be possible after all
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jan 10, 2019 19:18:32 GMT
Plus all I have is a sharp sword. I have a file and will travel for a round trip ticket and food. That sharp sword issue can be taken care of quickly enough. Hehehe A pell would be nice to have but not a necessity by any means.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jan 10, 2019 19:32:39 GMT
A word of thanks Venus. This thread got me doing my PT today. I missed it the last two but had a 3 or 4 days running doing it. I got sick about a couple of months ago for about a month and got out of the habit and am having difficulty re-establishing it. Let’s see what tomorrow brings.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 19:34:43 GMT
The edge is too nice for me to file haha. They did such a good job on it at at TFW forge. Perhaps I'll see if I can find a machining shop to cut me a rough shape from steel to train with.
And thanks for the ideas. We both gained something from this thread it seems
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on Jan 10, 2019 20:13:04 GMT
Consider making a wood practice sword for training. You can easily add weight and balance and your pretty sharp will stay unmarred...
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 21:18:06 GMT
Consider making a wood practice sword for training. You can easily add weight and balance and your pretty sharp will stay unmarred... What's a good way to add weight?
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Zen_Hydra
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Jan 10, 2019 22:19:43 GMT
If you are only worried about light contact with the edges, you might consider using a few layers of vinyl tape. That should protect from any accidental bumps or brushing contact.
I'm a firm believer in training with the tools you intend to use. You might consider trying to spend as much time as you reasonably can with your weapons in hand. It will help you become used to their weight, and make moving your body in unison with them feel more natural. Spend free time around your home exploring your space with the shield and sword. Doing so will help you intrinsically understand their measure, and give you more of an understanding on how to move through everyday obstacles with weapons in hand. As far as exercises go, in lieu of a pell you might consider hanging a tennis ball from a string for use as a target. Be sure to do plenty of calisthenics focusing on your shoulders and upper back. Also make an effort to work on your posture. Proper structure is the foundation everything else must build upon.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Jan 10, 2019 22:20:09 GMT
I do weight training for swords by doing sabre drill from the wrist with a baseball bat. Not at a speed where I can't control it, and not very often.
I also suggest pushups, jumping jacks, forearm and bicep/tricep exercises with dumbbells, and running. Practice extending the period you can train for, And regulating your breath.
I have also slipped in my exercise regimen. Need to get back into it.
Why not use your sabre and shield? I used my sabre with a buckler and had no trouble basically ignoring strikes from a longsword. Sabre guarding high/low, buckler guarding the opposite. The extensive hand guard pairs well with the protection offered by a shield and doesn't allow for hand strikes to be valuable for your opponent to try.
Edit: also Zenhydra is right. You have access to a gym? The row machine and chest press I have found useful.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 10, 2019 22:33:26 GMT
Jordan: Thanks for the tips. I shall include some of those exercises once I am done with my diet. I been cutting crazy amounts of calories to get a bit lighter, to be more agile, and plan to do heavy lifting once I normalize my diet, to make use of the calories. But I should be able to do cardio right now. Right now, my knee can't really handle the impact of jumping jacks due to all the injuries it sustained over last year.
My saber is the best weapon for my right now, due to its light weight and reach. But my sword of danu has some ritual/religious aspects for me (I even painted my shield with a crescent moon to match it), and with its short size, it is something I can pack in a suit case, to be hidden and taken with me to places easily. Not to mention its great for indoors. It is a wicked thruster.
I actually do have access to a gym. The apartment I just moved to has a gym in it, and I been planning to use it once I am done this diet
Zenhydra: Thanks for the tips. Thats an amazing idea. Just to have my shield strapped to my arm and sword in hand. Perhaps I can even work in some slow formations practice. Just to build muscle memory, and to aid in getting my body used to carrying and holding the stuff.
Back in my old Karate dojo, my teacher used to have us sometimes practice our kata, flexing the whole time, moving very slowly and precisely, and accelerating near the point of impact. Does anyone know if this is useless training? Or do you think it might be a sound idea, considering my limited training options?
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Post by markus313 on Jan 10, 2019 22:53:57 GMT
Talking about dynamic posture through movement / power generation / stability in (scottish broad)sword and targe specifically, I`d recommend Paul Wagner`s works/vids based on the writings of Thomas Page. For general health and strength, I`d be beneficial to at least have some basic and practical knowledge about the mechanics involved in exercises like the deadlift and its variants, for example. There`s a lot of stuff about that online (principles like “screwing” the feet, working up- and downwards through the "core", hinging the hips, “packing” the shoulders / neck etc.).
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Post by markus313 on Jan 10, 2019 22:55:45 GMT
Back in my old Karate dojo, my teacher used to have us sometimes practice our kata, flexing the whole time, moving very slowly and precisely, and accelerating near the point of impact. Does anyone know if this is useless training? Or do you think it might be a sound idea, considering my limited training options? When applied with proper principles of body mechanics, this could be a great way to exercise, imo, since it really helps to focus the awareness.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Jan 11, 2019 2:49:01 GMT
I can pack in a suit case, to be hidden and taken with me to places easily. Not to mention its great for indoors. It is a wicked thruster. I actually do have access to a gym. The apartment I just moved to has a gym in it, and I been planning to use it once I am done this diet I would err on the side of extreme caution if you're going to put a sword in a suitcase for self defense, unless I'm reading it wrong. Not knocking the idea behind it, and I'm not sure how it is in Canada but I really think you'd get in a lot of legal trouble if you did end up using it in self defense. The whole "he was looking forward to using a weapon and wanted to do damage" thing that I've heard of in courts. What I did for my diet was this - cut my calory intake by 50%, and eat mainly chicken, avocados, and yogurt as well as fruits when I could. I went from 190 to 158 in a few months with minimal exercise, starting to build up muscle and cardiovascular strength now.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jan 11, 2019 5:38:34 GMT
Markus: Thank you very much for the tips. i will be sure to look into those. They sound exactly right up my ally
Jordan: Definitely not for defense in like... Our civilized age, unless I was going somewhere dangerous, like my old home town, but even then, a bat or machete would be more practical in a weird way. But I was thinking more like SHTF type deals, where civilization is on the verge of breaking down. It is more of a concept than an actual thing.
I would also like it for the ease of transport because sometimes I find myself in vegabond situations, where I end up homeless, and have to store my stuff somewhere. I would want to keep something with me to train with if I can
What was your original calorie intake? I took mine down to 1200. Tho today I cheated
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Post by Jordan Williams on Jan 11, 2019 6:37:32 GMT
Markus: Thank you very much for the tips. i will be sure to look into those. They sound exactly right up my ally Jordan: Definitely not for defense in like... Our civilized age, unless I was going somewhere dangerous, like my old home town, but even then, a bat or machete would be more practical in a weird way. But I was thinking more like SHTF type deals, where civilization is on the verge of breaking down. It is more of a concept than an actual thing. I would also like it for the ease of transport because sometimes I find myself in vegabond situations, where I end up homeless, and have to store my stuff somewhere. I would want to keep something with me to train with if I can What was your original calorie intake? I took mine down to 1200. Tho today I cheated My original was probably around 3k, cut it down to probably around 1K. Used that for weight loss. Also I'm bad at math. 1/3 does not equal 1/2, oopsy. I'll also note that after 2 months of this I had to build back all of my muscle. So it's a trade off.
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