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Post by DirkS on Dec 1, 2018 15:38:08 GMT
Is this a good and original American Civil War M1860 sword? Blade markings: U.S. ADK 1862 and AMESMFGCº CHICOPEE MASS Hilt numbered: 14305 Scabbard marked ADK. Length: 107 cm. Many thanks for your review and opinion!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2018 17:58:05 GMT
Reproduction.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Dec 1, 2018 18:34:53 GMT
Yeah, It's a fake. Several details wrong such ad the grip, and spine detail, and Ames did not make 1860s in 1862.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2018 22:23:37 GMT
There were roughly 4500 of the new pattern "light" delivered in 1862 and would have the scroll makers mark seen on the top left of this page. The "1860" and "m1860" terminology is what most modern interests regard them but there was never an official ordnance designation as such. The pages above from the slim book from Hickox Although only 72 pages, well worth the price of a couple of pizzas John Hamilton's Ames book, out of print but they do surface and sometimes at original retail of about $50. Get 'em while he has a stash of them.. Brand new at retail pricing. The seller is A OK. www.simpsonltd.com/products/k1437Between the two books, the resources most of the recent authors cite for their own books and presentations. The Ames family was one of the early settlers in Massachusetts and bloomed unbelievably, with more than the sword family producing for general industry. By the ACW, the foundries of Ames were quite busy. There are reams of historical documentation aside from those two books but any interested in the Ames swords can get the Hickox title on Amazon for about $17. Scouring image searches a good place to start as well. Once schooled a bit, the first thumbnail pics in the first post should be caught as a reproduction without even viewing the full size piccies.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Dec 2, 2018 1:06:43 GMT
@edelweiss that's interesting to know. On other sites and forums I've just heard that Ames made 0 swords during that year.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2018 2:04:46 GMT
I'm not sure what sites and forums you are regarding but those stating that probably just don't have a lot of exposure to the swords, or are not familiar with the notes. There was no 1862 contract, as the ordnance board was still waiting for completion of the 1861 contract. Those delivered in 1862 are dated such, as that goes along with the inspection.
I'd write that off as not interpreting the numbers correctly. I know my math is a little off and with the bulk delivered in February, that could be contentious but I don't think it was just a weather issue.
Here ya go, let me Google that for you.
//www.horsesoldier.com/products/edged-weapons/swords/26625
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Post by DirkS on Dec 2, 2018 7:55:27 GMT
Thanks guys! I am happy these forums exist and not only in the sword collecting hobby.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Dec 2, 2018 8:26:15 GMT
I'm not sure what sites and forums you are regarding but those stating that probably just don't have a lot of exposure to the swords, or are not familiar with the notes. There was no 1862 contract, as the ordnance board was still waiting for completion of the 1861 contract. This must've been the mistake in interpretation then. I was under the same impression, that no contract of a year date meant no sabres with that year date.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Dec 2, 2018 8:43:01 GMT
Thanks guys! I am happy these forums exist and not only in the sword collecting hobby. I took some photos of my own 1860's hilt in the same way the dealer has his taken. I hope you can use them as a reference. Mine is made by Mansfield and Lamb.
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Post by likehotbutter on Dec 2, 2018 15:23:39 GMT
interesting that brass brazing was used on the repro
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2018 16:06:30 GMT
The brazing another easy tell.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Dec 2, 2018 19:34:36 GMT
Thanks guys! I am happy these forums exist and not only in the sword collecting hobby. imgur.com/a/YeCQxZN
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Post by DirkS on Dec 3, 2018 7:52:40 GMT
Thanks for all the extra information. It's very kind.
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Post by likehotbutter on Dec 3, 2018 11:56:51 GMT
The brazing another easy tell. Is it because it is so messy? I assumed most modern repros were tubular steel and didnt have the scabbard seam
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