Ouroboros
Member
Imperial, Mysterious In Amorous Array
Posts: 569
|
Post by Ouroboros on Oct 17, 2018 13:25:29 GMT
Today marks a historic occasion in the country of Canada. When most Canadians went to sleep weed/pot/Mary Jane was illegal. This morning when we rise and grab our cup o Tim Hortons (xl w 3 milk n a sweetener pls), it will be legal. Politics aside, I'd like to open this thread to respectfully discuss the social ramifications of the decision. I'm interested to hear some cultural perspectives on the pros and cons of legalization, pot use and how you identify yourself in this emergent culture. Some Pros Lightening up the court burden and freeing time for more important policing The lucrative days of grow ops feeding the black market are over in Canada The black market will be crushed by the availàbility of regulated weed Tax money can be used to build or refurbish infrastructure Lifting of the draconian research qualifications Quality control improvements Pretty good at helping some folks w panic and anxiety disorders (not to mention depression in some cases) Cons Driving while high will become more of a concern for law enforcement and A new bracket of offenses will find their ways into court The black market will adjust itself to serve the needs of society (lower prices, after hours delivery, higher quality, laced weed) Some members of the population will require help dealing with this New (to them) intoxicant Workplace consumption and public consumption not well defined Access will be easier for young people (education issue) My opinìon? It's a good thing to let adults make an informed decision on the vices they will enjoy. The pressures of the society which placed certain intoxicants or medicinal or natural remedies on a restricted substance list may not have come from the will of the norms and values which have survived, enshrined as some have become, to present day. The normative values of a culture evolve and expand or shrink the domain conditions of acceptable public behaviour. It would appear from this decision that the people of the Canadian Confederation are willing to accept those who have smoked/eaten/enjoyed this forbidden plant into the light of a common future with the beer and wine, rum and whisky drinkers. So, in my opinion you should look at the future of Canada as a place where people can decide to drink a beer, have a rum, eat a weedgummybear or slam back a bong without the fear of being arrested and charged for relaxing.... My opinion, this thread, and the knowledge that I smoke pot might damn me in some people's eyes but if the ancestors enjoyed It, ate of its seed, wove of its fibers and venerated it as a gift from Ja....who am I to ignore it's pain relieving, joint loosening, anxiety assisting goodness? Now, we all have opinions...lets hear em Happy Legalizzle Day Canada--tread carefully into that green future. Ouro
|
|
|
Post by nerdthenord on Oct 17, 2018 13:42:34 GMT
It's overall a darn good thing. I personally don't care for downers myself, but people have a right to this sort of thing that was taken away by greedy hypocritical politicians. Every sociological study on the subject shows that while legalization does have some drawbacks such as increased moter vehicle accidents, criminalization causes MANY more issues. It's also infuriating that these politicians say we can't use things like this, but they can.
LOVE the picture as well, man!
|
|
Ifrit
Member
More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
|
Post by Ifrit on Oct 17, 2018 14:10:57 GMT
It's definitely a good thing, even if it's just because it's more easily accessible for self medicaters. Sure doctors prescribed it, but it wasn't too easy to get a green card for most people. Some people know what helps them, and getting punished for a harmless action was just ridiculous.
I used to smoke it a lot, but I've since become allergic to it, sadly. I don't think I would have stopped if I didn't
|
|
Zen_Hydra
Moderator
Born with a heart full of neutrality
Posts: 2,623
|
Post by Zen_Hydra on Oct 17, 2018 14:24:23 GMT
It's a great thing, and (no pressure to those of you residing in the US's hat) how this plays out will shape policy for many other countries.
|
|
|
Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Oct 17, 2018 14:25:44 GMT
Not my cup of tea, but let's see what happens. The old Scythians smoked it, but where are they now?
|
|
|
Post by Cosmoline on Oct 17, 2018 15:47:20 GMT
We legalized it a few years ago up here in AK. So far I've been surprised by the number of pot shops opening up. Some are nice, others are like sleazy liquor stores. Potency is a big issue. I had partaken many times in the early 90's in college, but the pot at that point was mild. It would give a slight high, but less than alcohol. Only once did I start getting paranoid and that was about when I stopped. Flash forward to now where I have a wee brownie and BAM I'm practically paralyzed for several hours. I can't imagine that did my brain any favors. Unfortunately the draconian laws against the stuff made studying its effects very difficult. But I wouldn't be surprised to hear about neurological diseases increasing esp. with the increase in potency. We shall see. As far as crime, it has gone up but that appears to be related to budget-cutting laws that restrict prosecution of a long list of lessor felonies.
Overall, it's a positive move but should be combined with national changes.
|
|
|
Post by Jordan Williams on Oct 17, 2018 15:57:25 GMT
I've never been of the opinion that it's a particularly healthy thing for an otherwise healthy person to take part in, but I do think that it's legalization will do two things; one it will perhaps in time remove the "taboo", and with that maybe calm down the utterly cringey culture that's been built around it while it was illegal, and two I think we'll see some good, non - biased research on it which will give definitive proof as to its risks or rewards.
I don't know enough about it to say whether it's a good thing or not, but I do hope it's legalization aids in quelling the cartels. Though I don't see other drugs being legalized soon, so I don't think they'll be a result of it.
|
|
|
Post by demonskull on Oct 17, 2018 16:04:29 GMT
I'm old school, I didn't smoke when I was young and don't intend to if completely legalized here. I haven't had hard liquor in over 35 years and rarely drink beer or wine. When I do have a beer I don't drive period.
The right to decide is a personal thing and I don't have a negative attitude toward those that do responsibly. There are so many people who believe they can control the impulse to drink, gamble and use recreational drugs that just can't. We all know of people who either have or continue to drive drunk, gamble away their rent/mortgage. I don't see a real difference between these and any drugs.
The rational that it will bring down the price, create better product just doesn't make sense to me. It will just mean more people can afford to get more stoned, more often.
Legalization means we expect people to act responsibly, something I don't see happening enough justify legalization.
|
|
|
Post by nerdthenord on Oct 17, 2018 17:53:09 GMT
Living in a trafficking hub city, I’ve known people who have done most drugs out there. Everyone should have the right to do what they want with their bodies. I’ve never seen anyone ruin their life with pot, but I have seen people destroy themselves with alcohol, tobacco, meth, and heroin. I don’t do downers, and have never and will never do anything stronger than regular amphetamine, which I do legally to treat my ADHD. That it makes me feel like a god and makes me WAY better at anything requiring quick reaction time is more of a great side effect than the primary reason I use it. Fun fact: in ADHD patients like me amphetamine and other stimulants cause a significant increase in standardized test results, but in neurotypical people it only increases confidence, not actual results. It helps that amphetamine is only neurotoxic at temperatures exceeding 105 Fahrenheit. Stay the hell away from meth though. I’ve seen people with nothing wrong with them abuse amphetamine to the point it doesn’t work anymore, then switch to meth and absolutely destroy themselves, physically and psychologically. Meth isn’t directly neurotoxic despite the popular idea it is, but it is close. It interferes with the active carry proteins in the synapses that get rid of excess dopamine, causing dopamine to build of to neurotoxic levels and destroy their own receptors. It also compounds its own effects by increasing local temperature, making it even more potent and dangerous.
|
|
|
Post by howler on Oct 17, 2018 19:11:02 GMT
Don't see a problem with occasional use, although I don't partake myself as I don't like inhaling burned particulate matter (smoke) into my lungs. Some people, particularly the young, have problems being high all the time and therefore affecting their brains which do not fully mature until age 25. I see a difference between the occasional user and heavy habitual user (stoner), as they don't call it dope for nothing. I think Rick James said Cocaine was a hell of a drug, much more fun than weed but NOT the breakfast of champions.
|
|
Ouroboros
Member
Imperial, Mysterious In Amorous Array
Posts: 569
|
Post by Ouroboros on Oct 17, 2018 19:44:17 GMT
Hail demonskull ! The responsibility aspect is one that I expect we will see money spent on treatment programs and social programs to help folks deal if they can't help themselves. One thing my wife mentioned this morning was she thought it would help eliminated 'spiked' product wherein someone gets coke laced weed from an illicit deal. I don't expect the government sponsored stores, producers or quality control labs will make it inexpensive so, there may well be a black market adaptation to service those who cannot afford to goto the store. Jordan Williams I hope it removes the stimga of the pot-head being a deadbeat (but then again, we all know 'someone') and give a chance for some honest research into the beneficial compounds found in the plant. CBD oils when taken orally are known to give relief to join and muscle pain. Various terpenes have been shown to aid in anxiety. Though I doubt it will break any cartel, legalization at least offers the opportunity to, as Ifrit pointed out assist those who chose to self medicate. Im a fan for a number of reasons but do believe there should be limits and laws which curb abuse. Ouro
|
|
|
Post by RaylonTheDemented on Oct 17, 2018 21:27:51 GMT
This only my opinion, and I can say I didn't dig up the subject that much, but there it is:
Aside legal considerations, if I was to give a non-user 'average middle class' opinion, I don't think it will make a big difference in day-to-day life of users and non-users alike. Users will continue to use, wheter buying from their usual sources or buying legally.
I see non-users, possibly people with no connections to buy illegally or were afraid to break the law, may get curious and try and so create a new market. Most users may/will go in and try the legal pot, but mostly coming back to their black market source.
I was listening to radio calls this morning coming back from work, and people were saying you can have black market pot right now, house delivered, at half the price that is sold in the SQDC here in Quebec, so yeah, I fear our taxes will end up feeding the new state business with no money to show up for it, guess time will tell, economically speaking.
I remember a statement of our Prime Minister, saying one of the reason he wants to legalize pot is to help fend off the too easy access to the drug by children... Honestly, forgive the words, what a crock of semprini, legalization will make zero difference in that perspective.
o7
|
|
|
Post by Elrikk on Oct 17, 2018 22:13:32 GMT
I believe, and so does my brother in law in the DEA, that marijuana is a gateway drug. I never tried whisky or vodka til I had a beer...
Here in south jersey we have a Hugh heroin problem that’s killing at least 1 a day. 90% of them are habitual marijuana users also.
My 2 cents.
|
|
|
Post by Adrian Jordan on Oct 17, 2018 23:26:08 GMT
I've never used it, but I live in Humboldt County, an area pretty famous for it's marijuana culture, along with our neighboring county, Mendocino. It's not a great place, kind of a cesspool. I'll say that it was better before legalization, though. Before, it this was kind of an impoverished but low key area. Legalization didn't bring in some golden age of kindness and understanding. Most growers aren't interested in paying the sometimes enormous fees that have to meet similarly expensive regulations to become legal operations. Violent crime has gone up. Drug dealers and manufacturers from other states have flocked here thinking they could open up legal fronts at will only to find that this is not the case, so illegal grow operations and the number of purveyors of much harder, nastier drugs have increased. The huge amounts of money made from legal operations isn't really being cycled back in to the community. The number of junkies and vagrants has skyrocketed(and we already had a lot before), many of whom are very aggressive and/or suffer from mental illnesses. I've read that things are going much better in places like areas of Colorado, but in my area it's been a disaster.
|
|
Ifrit
Member
More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
|
Post by Ifrit on Oct 18, 2018 0:39:49 GMT
I believe, and so does my brother in law in the DEA, that marijuana is a gateway drug. I never tried whisky or vodka til I had a beer... Here in south jersey we have a Hugh heroin problem that’s killing at least 1 a day. 90% of them are habitual marijuana users also. My 2 cents. I know a ton of people who have smoked weed without having a desire to try anything else. People who wanna experiment with drugs try weed first yea, but it's not like it inspires people to try other drugs. The comparison of whiskey and beer is inaccurate. They are both alcohol. That's like saying beer made you wanna try something entirely different
|
|
christain
Member
It's the steel on the inside that counts.
Posts: 2,835
|
Post by christain on Oct 18, 2018 1:14:45 GMT
I used to smoke a little weed back in the day, but have since developed some sort of allergy to it. So has my sister. Swelling throat, pain, nausea, you-name-it...just BAD. I, personally, don't see a thing wrong with legalization. For God's sake...it's a PLANT. It was put on this world for a reason....everything was. I, also, believe it's much safer than drinking-and-driving. I learned my lesson on that years ago the hard way. You hear of drunk driver fatal car wrecks on a daily basis...When's the last time you ever heard of a car wreck because the driver was high?
Good for you, Canada! Toke up! I'm with you in spirit, if not in the smoke......
|
|
|
Post by Jordan Williams on Oct 18, 2018 1:31:49 GMT
For God's sake...it's a PLANT. It was put on this world for a reason....everything was. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_poisonous_plantsJust to point out that the oft - used saying of "it's a plant!" doesn't make a whole lot of sense on its own. And to touch on the driving comments www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2722956/So certainly much less prevalent than alcohol but still happens The study is inconclusive but does make the point that above a certain level marijuana does in fact impair driving, and using both marijuana and drinking alcohol at the same time is more dangerous than either (something I've seen many/heard many brag of habitual smokers do in my own experience, though limited as it may be) I don't have a dog in this race either way, but just wanted to address a few things I took some issue with in your post.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2018 1:44:56 GMT
I've never used it, but I live in Humboldt County, an area pretty famous for it's marijuana culture, along with our neighboring county, Mendocino. It's not a great place, kind of a cesspool. I'll say that it was better before legalization, though. Before, it this was kind of an impoverished but low key area. Legalization didn't bring in some golden age of kindness and understanding. Most growers aren't interested in paying the sometimes enormous fees that have to meet similarly expensive regulations to become legal operations. Violent crime has gone up. Drug dealers and manufacturers from other states have flocked here thinking they could open up legal fronts at will only to find that this is not the case, so illegal grow operations and the number of purveyors of much harder, nastier drugs have increased. The huge amounts of money made from legal operations isn't really being cycled back in to the community. The number of junkies and vagrants has skyrocketed(and we already had a lot before), many of whom are very aggressive and/or suffer from mental illnesses. I've read that things are going much better in places like areas of Colorado, but in my area it's been a disaster. So, political discussion is ok after all. Right? Let's do gun control, abortion and the death sentencing discussions as well. How about voting age? Drinking age?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2018 1:45:54 GMT
Hypocrites
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2018 2:00:25 GMT
Haile Selassie forever mon
|
|