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Post by tdiamante on Mar 11, 2018 23:57:18 GMT
Hi everyone, I haven't posted here in awhile; I've been busy dealing with some health issues in the family. I was commissioned by Paul Southren to create a prototype for one of the designs from the SBG Fantasy Design Competition. We had an in depth conversation about what was achievable given that I'm a one man workshop, and price. After assessing several designs, we chose celegon 's "Serpent's Bane" sword.  The purpose of this thread is to give members a place to provide feedback on the prototype design as it stands, and gauge interest. Are there features you'd like to see on the production model that aren't present? Does this fit the bill of what you look for in a fantasy sword? And most importantly is this something you would spend your money on? The prototype as it stands:     It should be noted noted that the sword also comes with a simple green scabbard(not pictured) Stats: Overall Length: 42.75in Blade Length: 32.5in Weight: 3lbs, 4oz Center of Balance: ~3.375in |
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 12, 2018 0:15:08 GMT
I think the sword you've made looks pretty good, but the illustration gives me a sense of a broader blade (less profile taper, more spatulate tip) and more prominent fuller, but maybe that's just me. I think the original designer would give the best feedback on accuracy.  This design doesn't really feel fantasy to me, but it got a slot in the lineup so it fit someone's bill. Nice sword, regardless. I like that shade of green. |
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stormmaster
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I like viking/migration era swords
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Post by stormmaster on Mar 12, 2018 0:42:11 GMT
i think it looks very similar to the original concept art, the only difference is the location where the guard and the blade actually meets is different but i can understand why it was done this way, it is fantasy enough for me tbh, with just the colors alone which works really well for me, but when i look at this piece the first thing that comes to mind is a gondorian sword Attachments:
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stormmaster
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I like viking/migration era swords
Posts: 7,714
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Post by stormmaster on Mar 12, 2018 0:44:11 GMT
which is not really a bad thing, the blade does appear to be slightly less wide but considering the weight as is, i think i would prefer this width, the original concept has a more rounded tip while the prototype has a more pointy tip
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Post by tdiamante on Mar 12, 2018 1:48:50 GMT
I think the sword you've made looks pretty good, but the illustration gives me a sense of a broader blade (less profile taper, more spatulate tip) and more prominent fuller, but maybe that's just me. I think the original designer would give the best feedback on accuracy. This design doesn't really feel fantasy to me, but it got a slot in the lineup so it fit someone's bill. Nice sword, regardless. I like that shade of green. All good points. I will say though that it was Celegon's comment on the design "rigid for piercing armor" that prompted the change to a more acute point. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2018 2:02:49 GMT
Hi, I rather like the looks of that! The pommel shape looks great for bracing with the palm for a thrust. As a decided pommel-gripper I'm a little on the fence of other applications, but for "run 'em through", the accute tip makes perfect sense and really the interpretation of an armor piercer you've got a good unity of design with the elements. I think you made some great choices. I hope the person who inspired this agrees!
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stormmaster
Member
I like viking/migration era swords
Posts: 7,714
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Post by stormmaster on Mar 12, 2018 2:29:00 GMT
the grip is also longer on the prototype, something i personally enjoy
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Post by Jordan Williams on Mar 12, 2018 6:37:11 GMT
I used to practice longsword and attend a hema club, and while I've fallen out of interest with medieval or medieval inspired pieces I actually do like this sword. It's very obviously fantasy but it's still very neat, clean, and competent looking.
So as far as liking it yes I do, but as for would I buy it feel like I'm the wrong person to comment on that as I really don't like medi swords enough to spend any decent amount in them.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 12, 2018 10:22:34 GMT
All good points. I will say though that it was Celegon's comment on the design "rigid for piercing armor" that prompted the change to a more acute point. Ah, then that makes more sense. |
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Mar 12, 2018 10:56:17 GMT
Looks good to me. As a sword maker I can understand why to pommel isn't the same, would be very hard to do without casing it or a milling machine. Think it will sale better than the other one's that have been posted here.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 12, 2018 11:09:51 GMT
... the only difference is the location where the guard and the blade actually meets is different but i can understand why it was done this way, It took me this long to notice the flared shoulders in the original art. I can see how it would be difficult to replicate, and would be willing to write it off, myself. That said, I probably won't be buying any of these, but I'm having fun looking at and talking about them. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2018 23:36:22 GMT
Now this is the kind of thread we need here. Sword makers asking our input in final sword design. Very enjoyable.  .....grip length is too long for 32 inch long blade. Hope different colors for grip as in black, ox blood, antique brown, etc., Cross guard ends look bland. Blade should be wider at the base. |
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Post by tdiamante on Mar 13, 2018 1:43:19 GMT
Hi, I rather like the looks of that! The pommel shape looks great for bracing with the palm for a thrust. As a decided pommel-gripper I'm a little on the fence of other applications, but for "run 'em through", the accute tip makes perfect sense and really the interpretation of an armor piercer you've got a good unity of design with the elements. I think you made some great choices. I hope the person who inspired this agrees! Thanks! |
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Post by tdiamante on Mar 13, 2018 1:47:51 GMT
... the only difference is the location where the guard and the blade actually meets is different but i can understand why it was done this way, It took me this long to notice the flared shoulders in the original art. I can see how it would be difficult to replicate, and would be willing to write it off, myself. That said, I probably won't be buying any of these, but I'm having fun looking at and talking about them. You are correct about the flared shoulders being difficult, or rather, inefficient. They would require starting from wider stock, thus raising the price. But hey, if that's a feature you really like in the design make yourself heard. This thread is really about trying to get to everyone to meet in the middle and create a product that's viable for the maker and everyone wants to buy. No bad opinions here |
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Post by tdiamante on Mar 13, 2018 1:51:55 GMT
Now this is the kind of thread we need here. Sword makers asking our input in final sword design. Very enjoyable. .....grip length is too long for 32 inch long blade. Hope different colors for grip as in black, ox blood, antique brown, etc., Cross guard ends look bland. Blade should be wider at the base. I'm glad you're enjoying the discussion. As for the grip length and color that's something Celegon would need to address since he was very specific on both of those elements. But I can tell you that on my end yes I can do the grip in any of those colors. On the blade width, do you think it should start wide and taper gradually, or have flared shoulders like the original art? |
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 13, 2018 2:00:46 GMT
Considering you use stock removal rather than forging, it would indeed be a waste of material (directly affecting cost) to use a piece that would allow for flared shoulders. That in mind, I feel they're a negligible change. They're a little too abrupt to do anything for me, anyway. I might also second that the hilt could be a bit shorter, but it seems really close to the original design specs, so maybe that's how long it's supposed to be. I'm fine with that, considering I'm just here to look.  |
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Post by 28shadow on Mar 13, 2018 2:50:45 GMT
I like this quite a bit. As noted above the grip can be a tad shorter for the blade length, but if it handles fine in it's current state I wouldn't change it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2018 6:55:06 GMT
Now this is the kind of thread we need here. Sword makers asking our input in final sword design. Very enjoyable. .....grip length is too long for 32 inch long blade. Hope different colors for grip as in black, ox blood, antique brown, etc., Cross guard ends look bland. Blade should be wider at the base. I'm glad you're enjoying the discussion. As for the grip length and color that's something Celegon would need to address since he was very specific on both of those elements. But I can tell you that on my end yes I can do the grip in any of those colors. On the blade width, do you think it should start wide and taper gradually, or have flared shoulders like the original art? Yes. These kind of threads benefit us all. If I was a sword maker, I would have many threads like this here. Could be a great source for market studies, surveys, questionnaires and polls. I do not think the flared shoulders are needed. Starting wide with a gradual profile taper is always a fan favorite. |
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Post by Croccifixio on Mar 13, 2018 7:14:23 GMT
I really like your aesthetic Tomas. I'm just gonna say that the looks for me need no improvement. Handling will be another thing, but I'm pretty confident you'll do well there.
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Post by celegon on Mar 16, 2018 4:27:16 GMT
Sorry for the late post, i wanted to read some feedback of others before i voiced my own, first of all I'm really sorry to hear about the health problems, i hope everything's improving now.
you have done an amazing job and i appreciate all your hard work , so i hope i don't come across as nitpicky, but i feel like i need to be honest about my thoughts
when i designed this sword i wanted a strong battle worthy sword that was fantasy, but based in reality, so yea they are some. numenorean elements to it, but i felt like it was still low key enough to fit into any other fantasy worlds, I though of it as this projects fantasy bastard sword, like what dark sword armoury has done with thier "feanor" or " sage " swords
i did have practical a reason for the some of the design choices, like the risers below the pommel and guard, i included those not only for looks but they were intended to stick out slightly more than the grip so it gave a flat edge for the leather wrap to butt up against, so there would be no leather wrapping over hang on the ends of the grip
the fittings were thought of with cast bronze in mind. i can understand brass being used in its place. but since they were thought of to be bronze casted, it makes the fittings harder to bring to life with grinding methods. so the result is having to adapt the design as you go, and when you do that you can lose the concept
i can understand changes needing to done while in the process of making it but
but its like this sword was changed from concept way more than the others that were picked ,the guard, the flared blade shoulders, the waisted grip, the risers,the shortened pommel..i could understand some of them being left off or changed but when all of these design features are left off and you start asking " what isnt needed" it begins to change and it leaves the piece feeling really different than it was originally
i had intended the riser and pommel and the guard and riser to be solid pieces but if some brass spacers were cut out and shaped right , they could be placed above the pommel and guard,and if the pommel was a bit more shaped like this, i think it would improve it a lot, cause it looks a bit flat and blocky at the moment
www.kultofathena.com/images/AH4241F_5_l.jpg
and another thing about having bronze in mind, the sword was meant to have strong ties to the ocean, so the bronze sort of give sit that nautical look, if there was some chemicals added to patina the brass I think it would look good, and give it that bronzey ocean look
i had a secondary set of designs that i had submited during the sword contest, but they were lost in communication, and for months i had no idea this sword was being made..i feel like if i had known or have been in the loop i could have helped with any redesigns..or to clear up any design questions, i still have other drawings for the hilt parts, and the sheath
Also you made the right call on the blade point, mine was too broad
As for the handle, I don't think 10 inchs is too much for a handle for a sword this size, ( 10 inches from end of pommel to the blade shoulders) I've seen others with that length or longer. but since the pommel was changed so much,and is much shorter i think the grip should be shortened,it looks a bit off now and too long.
but yea, i really hope i dont come across as nitpicky, everyone was being honest in this thread about it so i decided to be honest about my thoughts too, im in no way dismissing all the hard work youve done, cause i do appriciate you and Paul and everyone who has helped in this project .its just that the sword was a passion of mine and its frustating cause i can picture it all in my head, but i cant draw worth a damn lol but i feel like we can work out any of the design details giving enough time
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