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Post by uchiha998 on Aug 13, 2017 3:42:56 GMT
I'm very curious about this because I have seen it written and heard it said "koto feels light, shinto feels heavy." I forget who originally wrote this but I would like to know why this is and if it is really true. I understand it will not be a universal truth if it is true. There were blades of all shapes, sizes and purposes in every era. Still in general why would Later period koto katana be or feel lighter than an earlier shinto? I would think it would be the opposite since of course the extra weight and power derived from a tip heavy balanced sword(which makes a sword feel heavy even if it doesn't really weigh heavy). Koto blades would have been made to be used in battle where it would have had to cut through armor or at least survive many collisions with armor. Heavier blades would have just made sense during this time of war.
However shinto period blades on the hand would have been made focusing on one on one sword dueling against opponents wearing usually wearing kimono and hakama. Little to no armor. If it were me during this type of battle I would want a fast, lively, and agile blade. Since I don't have to worry about any armor just a good clean slash and its over. Or a quick little feint one way, then when they begin to respond to a simple turn of the wrist flips the blade in the other direction and a tiny nick to an artery and the were done. So I guess I'm asking is this generally true and if so what were the reasons swordsmiths start making heavier blades in the shinto era. If anyone has any insight into this please explain what you know.
Also are most production Katana simply modled after typical edo era blades or are they more variety than that. I know some of course are not the Nanbukocho Raptor or any Kogarasu-maru blade for instance. But I'm wondering abut the majority of production katana.
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Post by Adrian Jordan on Aug 13, 2017 4:03:54 GMT
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Post by Verity on Aug 13, 2017 4:05:31 GMT
I think it probably has more to do with the fact so much more effort was put into balance into a war period blade. By the later samurai periods the swords were more hip-accessories and were used in duels but seldomly. Though yes many types and exceptions exist all over the place. Also remember many many koto and nambokucho blades became suriage or o-suriage and lost a lot of length from some of the monster blades that existed.
I can say that, owning both a shinshinto blade and a nambokucho blade the nambokucho has a narrower sugata with more fumbari than the shinshinto blade. But that hardly makes for a generalization.
Most modern replica are pretty generic late edo sugata or showato even... (again, exceptions exist, especially in the custom realms).
Not necessarily a full explanation but my own observations as to the inquiry.
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Post by vermithrax on Aug 13, 2017 22:07:40 GMT
Always an interesting question. Here are a couple of very nice articles that can lay it all out: Koto Era Swords: jssh.org/koto.htmlShinto Era Swords: jssh.org/shinto.htmlOne can make the argument, and on a purely technical basis I agree, that Koto blades (generally, a bad sword will always be a bad sword regardless of era it was made poorly) are better blades in construction and specific activities that were from the era. That said, even nihonto fans like Verity and I differ in our tastes; Shinto swords of the Kanbun era make up probably 90% of my want list swords for reasons specific to me. Everyone is different.
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Aug 14, 2017 10:13:06 GMT
This is the "stereotypical" shape guide by NBTHK.  But those are only stereotypical swords that were kinda defining the era. There can be very little difference in some swords made 1570 vs. 1640 for example. It is often said by those that "bash" or "critique" Japanese swords that the sword changed very little and when you look at above diagram for blade shapes it is true. The large war swords that were in use from Kamakura to Muromachi were kinda the only ones really breaking the mold with their unusual size. Yes there were changes in mounting & size but when you look at bigger picture the difference for something like 400 years might not be too large. The "problem" with Edo period swords is they saw very little fighting. Where as earlier periods had fighting and wars going on. I know people are hyped about samurai duels etc. during Edo period but it was not really common. Swordsmanship declined, sword making declined, armor making declined because there was no need for new swords or armors as the country was in peace for so long. There is a difference in steel used in the old times and in the new times, new steel was better quality and more uniform in general (Some old sword purists might cut my head off from saying that but I think more modern methods produce higher quality in average, likewise modern tool steels are great for swords). Also new swords are generally polished less. I'm no expert on how martial arts developed in Japan but as Paul Martin said in his article above that thrusting in dojo became much more important and thicker profile is good for thrusting while thinner is better for cutting. I think in general that "koto feels light, shinto feels heavy" saying is geared towards the notion that old swords were of superior make. Even though I focus my collecting on old swords I do not fully think like that. Good swords and bad swords were made during all periods. It is amazing to see for example c. 1000 year old swords from legendary smiths but they have much legend attached to them and in reality they most likely are not superior to for example modern made swords. However it is remarkable what the smiths achieved 1000 years ago when you think the level of technology and knowledge back then. That legend about old swords is part of the charm in collecting swords, at least for me.
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Post by treeslicer on Aug 14, 2017 14:52:26 GMT
.............Some old sword purists might cut my head off from saying that............ And risk chipping one of my prized koto blades? Not bloody likely. Excellent post. IMHO, some older blades may feel lighter for their length than later ones because they have lost mass due to repeated polishing.
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