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Post by Jason Summer on Mar 8, 2016 18:07:47 GMT
I was sparring with my brother, who knows nothing of swords, and he started doing a spin attack from Legend of Zelda, so of course I thought "You fool!" And decided to end him. But I realized I didn't know how to proceed. I know full well it's a weak attack, with no form or function, but I surprisingly couldn't counter it. I had a dirk and a knife, he had a longsword, and the idea I thought of was to stick my dirk into it, like a stick in bicycle spokes, then rush in with the dagger. My dirk broke, and my fingers got smashed. Now what?
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Mar 8, 2016 18:18:32 GMT
Well, if he has a longsword and you only have two knives, it's already a highly unfair situation. No wonder the spin-thing worked.
Essentially what you want to do is attack him as soon as he is starting to turn his back towards you (if that's what you mean with spin attack. I have never played Zelda). Short or long weapon, it's the same approach, once his sword is off-line, you move. The short weapon makes it a lot harder though since you need to close in much farther in order to be able to hit him. I would literally jump him.
Alternatively, step back, let him strike and attack once his sword point has moved past you. Only works if he don't recover quickly. Again, having only a short weapons makes this much harder.
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Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,451
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Post by Aikidoka on Mar 8, 2016 20:49:37 GMT
Do you mean like this? If so, then yes, as was mentioned above, wait until the tip of the sword passes by, then move in close, inside his point. Then you'll have the advantage with your shorter weapons. And remember to use one hand to control the hilt of his longsword, so you don't get pommeled in the face
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 8, 2016 22:35:59 GMT
I'd say it depends. Since you have a shorter weapon, it is harder. With a longer weapon, if the spin wasn't something that was in good rhythm, there are two things that would happen: he'd be out of range, I'd let it pass by and get in range and attack, or he is in range and the moment he turns his head/body, I strike in close. With a dagger, I'd take the first option as has been stated. Use one weapon to attack, the other to bind if possible. Spinning like that isn't so great because even if all you do is backpedal, he still wastes energy and the spin has a longer window to be seen coming.
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pgandy
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Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Mar 8, 2016 23:32:37 GMT
The above methods should work. However assuming that you have no buckler or shield only a blade I would step in facing the swing squarely and block with the blade vertical. The only two cuts that can be made with the spin are the #3 or #4, so relatively easy to stop. While it’s possible to use two blades to trap the incoming I prefer to use one with both hands, one hand holding the grip and the second well up on the blade. DO NOT WRAP YOUR FINGERS AROUND THE BLADE. Instead keep the hand behind the blade and block with the flat targeting the sword’s forte. This in affect will give a strong defence. Once the incoming is stopped you will have several options including a take away. At first go slow with this until you build confidence. It will be easier to execute than you think.
Below is a short video my neighbour helped with to check out my dagger. No #3 & #4 cuts here but the #1s s are close enough to give an idea. I am out of practice and it shows in the video and we had never worked together. I think my neighbour had concerns on my behalf in the beginning as you will see him hesitate and ask if I am sure at the beginning. I assured him that I would be OK. For good measure I wore protective gear as I am a strong believer in Murphy’s Law. While that CS trainer had no cutting edge it could have broken me up a bit. At one point I unintentionally applied too much pressure taking him down and with his weight advantage he pulled me with him. In a real situation I would have followed taking advantage of my position. As it was I unsuccessfully tried to hold him up. One is not greatly disadvantaged with a dagger but one must have confidence and close, closer the better getting inside of his blade. I enjoyed myself and it made me wish all the more that I still had a sparring partner.
Just had an afterthought. My first martial arts experience was judo and that was over a half century ago. I thought my biggest lesson was learning how to fall which saved my butt many times in the years that followed. Thinking back on it maybe it taught me to get in close where I grasp my opponent, can’t get much closer than that. This feels natural to me and might contribute to me not feeling uneasy with short blades.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Mar 9, 2016 3:46:50 GMT
I was sparring with my brother, who knows nothing of swords, and he started doing a spin attack from Legend of Zelda, so of course I thought "You fool!" And decided to end him. But I realized I didn't know how to proceed. I know full well it's a weak attack, with no form or function, but I surprisingly couldn't counter it. I had a dirk and a knife, he had a longsword, and the idea I thought of was to stick my dirk into it, like a stick in bicycle spokes, then rush in with the dagger. My dirk broke, and my fingers got smashed. Now what? Throw knife at head, and rush him after?
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 9, 2016 4:43:28 GMT
In some cases, I'd agree as I've been known to throw my wakizashi from time to time, but unless the hit or follow up is pretty much assured, I wouldn't throw.
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Post by Croccifixio on Mar 9, 2016 6:05:41 GMT
React with shock and a chuckle as you step back and take a nap.
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Post by Jason Summer on Mar 9, 2016 6:44:30 GMT
I was sparring with my brother, who knows nothing of swords, and he started doing a spin attack from Legend of Zelda, so of course I thought "You fool!" And decided to end him. But I realized I didn't know how to proceed. I know full well it's a weak attack, with no form or function, but I surprisingly couldn't counter it. I had a dirk and a knife, he had a longsword, and the idea I thought of was to stick my dirk into it, like a stick in bicycle spokes, then rush in with the dagger. My dirk broke, and my fingers got smashed. Now what? Throw knife at head, and rush him after? They are wooden, so I can't throw them without causing injury. And that's also why I can't rush him. I guess I just need to get some armor.
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 9, 2016 7:44:56 GMT
Wait, you can throw wood without harming. I throw my wooden wakizashi all the time, not at the head mind you (though we wear hockey helmets so that wouldn't be an issue; the issue is that the head is small). And rushing is also doable. An idea is to rush and use your knives to bind him up and make it hard for him to move. I used to have a pair of wooden butterfly knives and that was a strategy I used against longer reach weapons all the time with good success. The key is confidence in movement. If you are afraid and don't know what to do, you'll freeze up. Practice, be confident, and cross that bridge.
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Mar 9, 2016 9:56:04 GMT
Just side step and trip him as he spins by. Won't know why people want to take a attack head on. Some people will know want I mean when I say this triangle.
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 9, 2016 10:03:15 GMT
I'm a bit confused. If he is using a longsword, how can one side step a spinning attack and still be close enough to trip without getting cut by the spin? I am picturing spinning attack like he described, Link's signature tornado spin thing. As that goes in a complete circle, there is no side not being cut at. This is why a few of us recommended either letting the sword pass and attacking or, if close enough, rush. if we are picturing the same kind of spinning attack, could you describe how you'd side step it?
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Mar 9, 2016 10:32:00 GMT
When you side step he has to change the direction of his attack. Give you time to attack from behind
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 9, 2016 10:53:49 GMT
Oh, so the side step is just a specific direction of the previous "step out of the way" and then the action after moving in is "trip them." I was picturing someone side stepping and sticking their foot out and tripping the other person and their sword whizzes by and they land on their face, cartoon style, lol.
In the way I imagined it, the sword was in range and you attempt to step to the side only to get cut.
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Mar 9, 2016 11:45:59 GMT
You could trip them as they go just duck and do a leg sweep.
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Post by Kiyoshi on Mar 9, 2016 11:58:27 GMT
Often easier said than done. I have won matches against people who try to sweep as a counter, though I've never had someone try when I was doing a Link style tornado spin either (I rarely do any kind of spins while fighting).
We had an exercise in my swordsmanship classes where we'd walk forward repeat an action over (like a downward strike) and over and at one point, the opponent would suddenly change to a dodge and another cut (ie, rotate the body and strike to the ribs) and we had to stop our attack mid-strike, let the attack whiff, then adapt and attack the opponent again. It was a great exercise for getting reaction, spacing, and timing down. Perhaps this kind of training may help you defeat your hylian-hearted brother?
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Post by plainsman on Mar 9, 2016 12:55:54 GMT
This is not a sword attack, it's a defense to a spinning back kick. But maybe something like this would be possible?
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Post by MOK on Mar 9, 2016 14:36:22 GMT
Whenever someone does that sort of thing my first instinct is always to simply move straight in and cut their arms or stab them in the back. Spinning kicks and such can work, but they need to be set up properly.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Mar 9, 2016 17:05:19 GMT
Throw knife at head, and rush him after? They are wooden, so I can't throw them without causing injury. And that's also why I can't rush him. I guess I just need to get some armor. Yeah, I'd get proper gear before sparring anymore. Like gloves
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Post by Lancelot Chan on Mar 9, 2016 17:13:21 GMT
In ur case, where you're holding off options and your bro is not caring about your safety by doing reckless spinning attack, I think you're putting urself at a very serious disadvantage.
Not weapon, but mindset. He obviously DUN CARE.
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