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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 28, 2012 1:54:49 GMT
Hello sword people. Recently i have developed a saber itch that must be scratched. I had been looking at other swords as well, two hand swords mostly, but ultimately i decided that i really wanted some sort of saber. While I have done a good amount of reading reviews and comparing prices, I would really like some of your opinions. That is why I joined up here, to hear some of your thoughts. I have narrowed my list to about 4 swords: www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... alry+Saber www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... sain+Saber www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... alry+Saber www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... icer+Saber Now, by no means do I have to buy from that site, it was just easiest to find 'em there. I'm completely open to other ideas of where to buy though. I have read reviews about all of these swords Except the 1852 Prussian. It seems that I am the only person who thinks that sword is beautiful. I couldn't find Anyone talking about that sword. As for the Windlass 1840 vs the Cold Steel 1860, I guess to narrow my list even more I need to decide which of those would be the better buy. I lean more towards the Cold Steel, simply because I know the company has an outstanding customer service reputation and outstanding products and because I have never heard of windlass before I started doing research (admittedly, i have never known anything about swords, so that may just be my own ignorance of a good company) As for the other Windlass, I guess I just kind of like the idea of having a cool C.S.A. saber. I have only found one review on this confederate saber, and to be honest it was disheartening. Although the person said it was a good sword for the money, it seemed to me that it would be more comfortable hanging on a wall. I suppose the real choice for me is between the 1860 heavy cavalry saber and the 1852 Prussian saber. The real reason I threw windlass in there was in hopes of finding a civil war saber of equal quality and durability for a better price. If anyone actually has a Cold Steel 1852 Prussian, I would really like to hear from you. I absolutely love the way that sword looks. It's a real bummer when you look up this stuff, and there is a video or at least a review for almost every other thing, but not one for a saber you're looking at. By the straight look of the sword, I would guess that it favors the thrust. What I really want to know is how this sword compares to the other sabers in cutting abilities. Well, i guess there's no real question here, just lookin' to hear what y'all think. Thanks!
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Post by Kumdoalan on Oct 28, 2012 2:25:32 GMT
I think you need to post the links again, but without that hyphen at the start....then it may work better
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Alan Schiff
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Manufacturers and Vendors
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Post by Alan Schiff on Oct 28, 2012 2:29:52 GMT
Windlass is a good choice for sabers and cutlasses, sometimes less so for other swords. I myself have handled a number of their curved swords and they were excellent for the price.
Concerning whether CS is a better choice, something that you and others deciding between CS and Windlass, should know is that Cold Steel uses the same forge in India that Windlass does and, at least in the past, some of their blades were actual Windlass blades with the maker's mark polished mostly out. That is why many of their swords look similar to the Windlass pieces, although the original designs and specs may vary slightly.
Kult of Athena is a great place to buy from and their customer service is excellent. If you live in the US I don't personally think there's a better place to buy from customer service wise. They also do price matching if you can find something cheaper from another vendor.
Hope that helps, Alan
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Oct 28, 2012 3:44:21 GMT
I like the Prussian. Very nice looking sword. I like the Confederate saber better, though. It looks a lot like a Liu Ye Dao.
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Post by Alfacentori on Oct 28, 2012 4:56:30 GMT
I have never owned any of these, the only sabre I own in a CS 1796 LCS. I like the look of the 1860 and the 1840, especially the 1860, although as I'm sure you know from the reviews CS makes their swords a bit heavy compared to historic originals. That said I like the feel of my 1796.
They are all good first choices, it mainly comes down to what you want to spend, as there is a fair bit of difference in $$ between one ones you have selected, and what you want to do with it, i.e wall hanger or cutter. Whatever you choose be sure to post up a review, I would be interested to know your impressions.
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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 28, 2012 21:05:50 GMT
:evil: I am so upset right now! I just took about an hour writing a reply, to try to paint a better picture of my thought process about these swords. I clicked submit, and sure enough, it had somehow logged me out and everything I wrote disappeared! :x I'll be back and try again later. Just so frustrating
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Post by Warlokk on Oct 28, 2012 21:13:58 GMT
My advice when it comes to sabers: Look over Dave Kelly's collection, and if there's something in there that he has that is along the lines of what you're interested in, it would be an excellent choice for you. He knows more about them than just about anyone around
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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 29, 2012 6:02:20 GMT
I was actually also considering the CS 1796 LCS, before I narrowed my decision. Once I win the power ball I will put it back on my list, but for my first sword I would rather have less curve. I do recall seeing that CS makes their swords a bit heavier, but I never really thought of that as a bad thing. I guess I just figured built heavier equaled durability..? $260ish is pretty much the max I want to spend, but even that is pushing it. Honestly, I'm broke right now. I'm just trying to do my research and questioning ahead of time, so that as soon as I get the money I will be ready to buy. I want to buy a sword, because I want a sword, not a decoration. I want something you would trust to go into battle with. While I do like the Confederate saber quite a bit, I don't know how well I feel about it next to a CS. I have only been able to find one review of this sword, and to me, it was disheartening at best. viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7698The cons that the guy goes through are all unacceptable in my opinion. That is to say, if I ordered and received a saber identical to his, flaws and all, I would be very unhappy. Overall, it does not sound like it meets my criteria for a battle ready sword. It just really looks so nice. Another thing I have been pondering is the blade edges. I know that CS sell their steel sharp, and that Windlass blades have to be sharpened by the dealer or whomever (i have no interest in finding a way to get this thing sharpened myself). The problem arises if, god forbid, someone makes a mistake and something isn't right about the blade. If it is CS, I have read numerous reports of outstanding customer service. And apparently they pay shipping both ways and do whatever they have to to make it right. If it is a Windlass, or anything other than CS, would they make it right also or would I just be stuck with a sub-par sword? I only bring this up because the Confederate sword in that review seemed to have some kind of irregularity about its' blade. I honestly don't really know what the issue was, I don't know what 'secondary bevel' means. I can only assume that if it is worth mentioning, then it is not the way the sword is supposed to be, and that is unacceptable to me. I have wondered if anyone thinks that the CS 1860 may be a little too much sword for strictly non-cavalry use? I started thinking about the fact that I don't have a horse, and will Most likely Never be wielding a sword on a horse. I know that cavalry swords were generally longer, heavier, and more curved than a foot soldiers sword to facilitate better use on horseback. So with that knowledge, would it make more sense to be looking at a saber like the 1852 Prussian which is lighter, straighter, and probably wieldier? Or is the 1860 just as good off a horse as on a horse? I am just really curious about the cutting potential with the Prussian. While I know that the 1860 can easily be a devastating slasher, it seems that it would also be a great stabbing weapon and even possibly have an advantage over a straight blade. On the other hand, i have never seen what pipe back saber can do. I have no doubt that it would excel in stabbing, and that it would probably not compare to the 1860 in slashing. But sometimes things can surprise you, and I am wondering if it's possible that I might be surprised and find that the Prussian actually cuts very well... ..speculation... Sorry about writing so much guys.. Thanks for your replies!
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Oct 29, 2012 8:19:24 GMT
If you like the lines of the Confederate Saber, you could always look into Chinese sabers. Very similar profile to the liu ye dao (willow leaf dao).
Wait, flaws? The scabbard is enough to make it a not battle ready sword? The gold flake? The cheap leather and wire on the grip? Or are you talking about KoAs bad sharpening job? You can always order it unsharpened and put the edge on it yourself.
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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 29, 2012 8:56:15 GMT
Well, i do like the lines of that saber. I think I like it, though, mostly for the combination of the lines with the cool designs and C.S.A markings on it. Also, I guess concerning these sabers, part of what draws me is the hilt. I'm not exactly sure which swords you are talking about when you say Chinese sabers. Any specific examples? I looked into the Chinese swords, a Little bit, and i do like them. But those are completely different styles. Pretty awesome swords all the same. Actually, about 2 years ago or so, I was 100% sure the CS Chinese War sword would be my first. www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... +War+Sword Needless to say, this sword has been forcibly bumped off the lift by my recent obsession with sabers. I was just lookin' around a bit, and of course I found something else I like. If I suddenly had a ridiculous amount of extra cash (emphasis on 'ridiculous') this guy here would quickly make his way up my list.. www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... Song+Sword This one is pretty cool too-- www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... +Steel+Dao But like I said, I think I'm still leaning heavy towards those more western saber designs right now
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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 29, 2012 9:19:57 GMT
Okay, perhaps saying 'not battle ready' because of the imperfections in the fitting of the scabbard and the cheap leather and wire is over exaggerating. I was definitely referring to the bad sharpening job as well though. Here is how I see it: if I am going to spend any substantial sum of MY money on something, I don't want a cheap POS. I guess I just look at those little things, and then look at how CS doesn't have these 'hang-ups' If I buy something from CS, I expect it to be perfect and if it isn't, I expect them to take care of the problem. Perhaps the sword in that review was just a 'lemmon'. But if quality control ships out swords like that, that makes me have serious doubts about purchasing. Like I said, I don't want to spend my hard earned bucks on a piece of crap that is made cheaply. Likewise, understand, I also don't want to spend my money on a brand new saber that has defects.
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Post by Alfacentori on Oct 30, 2012 6:53:23 GMT
For those who like traditional sabres, i.e. light and 'fencible' the extra weight is a real negative, as it ruins the handling characteristics compared to an original. That said more strength is good, and if you have never owned, and will never own a real one (they can be quite pricey), I can't see an issue. You can get a nice sabre for that, and it will be battle ready. That said, you have to remember that $260 is not a high price point as far as swords go, so you expectations have to be realistic. I like my 1796, it has a few minor flaws, but for what I paid I'm happy, and it would certainly be at home on a battlefield. Sabres were after all a soldiers weapon, and most were mass produced as a tool for killing, not a work of art. I don't know on customer service, Kult of Athena are recommended for their customer service record and quality checking, so you should be in safe hands buying from them. As for a 'secondary bevel' I had to look this one up when I first heard it, see this post on the old board for a picture. sbgswordforum.proboards.com/inde ... y&thread=6 Well I don't think you need to own a horse to justify owning a sabre As for how the 1860 handles, as I don't own one I can't say, hopefully someone with some hands on experience will chime in.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2012 8:05:26 GMT
I would recommend going into a shop first and having a look at the sword you intend to buy, as I think your expectations are a bit unrealistic and you may be somewhat disappointed with whatever you might buy at your budget. You won't get anything 'perfect' for $250. Depends what you really mean by perfect really. It may not have any major flaws, it shouldn't but the finish may be a bit less refined overall. Minor details may not be 100%, small cosmetic things.
I have the Cold Steel 1830 Napoleon Saber, I think it looks great, whether you like the handling is entirely a personal matter. I really do recommend handling the swords first if possible.
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Oct 30, 2012 9:14:57 GMT
How much of the writing on the blade is advertising?
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Post by twin-rabbit on Oct 30, 2012 22:37:49 GMT
I would love to be able to go handle a bunch of swords before buying. However, I highly doubt I will have the opportunity. Unless anyone knows of any 'sword stores' near Clearwater or Tampa FL....
As for 'perfect', I suppose this can be subjective. I just think that anytime you buy something brand new, quality control (of Any company) should weed out the flaws. I know that Cold Steel even has something they call 'sword seconds', which is the somewhat flawed swords they catch. They sell these swords at a discounted price due to the flaws. Maybe even just for that reason alone, that is why I believe that it should Not be unrealistic to find a 'perfect' (brand new) sword within my budget. Just for examples, both of the CS sabers on my list are within my range. Unless someone is of the opinion that Kult of Athena will deliver me a sub-par CS blade..
I look for the same kind of quality assurance when I have bought guns as well. If I want a gun (perhaps for a cheaper price) and I don't mind it having cosmetic imperfections, as long as it functions properly, I will look at Used guns. If I am looking to buy a Brand New gun, it will Not have Any cosmetic (or other) irregularities. No one should have to worry about buying a brand new thing, and receiving it in less than "perfect" condition. I guess I am a real stickler about quality control. When quality control sends out products with imperfections, it makes me have serious doubts about the integrity of said company..
Sorry, guess I got stuck on that for a sec.
I'm not sure I really understand this question..
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 1, 2012 8:41:14 GMT
On this link you can see a very large CSA on the blade. www.kultofathena.com/product.asp ... icer+Saber If this is advertising the manufacturer I would be asking for $1 every time I waved the blade or it's removal!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2012 13:47:17 GMT
Quality control costs money, and it's a sliding scale, the more expensive a sword is, the better the quality control. There is a big (visible) difference in the quality and finish between a sword that costs $100, $300, $500 and $1000. You'll get the feel for it after you get your first sword or two if you buy from reputable firms.
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Post by twin-rabbit on Nov 1, 2012 19:39:28 GMT
I guess I understand what you're saying. When I do get my first sword or two, if they do have flaws, perhaps I won't even notice since I'm new to these things. As I know that my price limit will not exceed $300, I'll hope for a good one that 'reasonably' meets my expectations.
I think that either I am still not quite understanding you, or you are not quite understanding what that sword is.. It is a reproduction of a Confederate Officers' saber. We're talkin' American Civil War. The Union in the north, the Confederate States of America (C.S.A.) in the south. It is not advertising a manufacturer. It is more of a salute to the south, so to speak. I have recently become somewhat enamored with all things Confederate, which is why it was very easy for this sword to find its' way onto my list.
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 2, 2012 1:46:49 GMT
Thanks, now makes more sense, I just hate excessive advertising on things I buy, a good example can be seen on Japanese light trucks, where the entire rear end says TOYOTA or some other brand stamped into the metal work, sometimes I wonder why you don't see "Built by Fred" in three foot letters on a house :lol:
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Post by twin-rabbit on Nov 26, 2012 21:06:59 GMT
I have read, multiple times, people saying that Cold Steel swords come with a saber training video. Does anyone know if there is any truth behind this? I do think I remember this being mentioned in connection with Kult of Athena. Perhaps it is something exclusively offered, with a purchase from KoA?
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