TFW Hagibis review
Jun 21, 2012 8:45:08 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2012 8:45:08 GMT
This is my first review, please forgive the poor pics and lack of video.
I knew what was in the triangle shaped Priority mail box as soon as I saw it sticking out of my mailbox. Hagibis! My first purchase from www.traditionalfilipinoweapons.com ( TFW) was well packed, with a protective grease and plastic film on the blade itself, stored in the scabbard and then wrapped in several layers of bubble wrap. Additional padding was placed at the ends of the box. It arrived 3 business days after I ordered it, via USPS priority, which is included in their base shipping price, even though the website indicates first class. Cool!
I’m not new to the world of knives. At one point I owned over 200 knives, mostly production, brands like BRKT, Microtech, Dalton, Kershaw and CS and a smattering of Fallkniven, Protech, MOD, Dawson, etc. Eventually I narrowed that down to the current 50 or so, but I do have some definite opinions on what I should get for my dollar when it comes to knives. I do not, however, have any training or background in s.e. Asian martial arts, so I can only guess when it comes to how the designer of this weapon intended it to be used. For those that are interested, there appear to be quite a few videos available on Pikiti Tirsia Kali.
I’ve had the Hagibis for about three days now, enough time for the “new toy joy” to wear off a bit, and for me to do some cutting and sharpening. I guess not in that order.
Historical: From the TFW website:
This system appears to have quite the reputation. From Wikipedia:
Full disclosure: I have no affiliation with TFW, Pekiti Tirsia Kali, or any Filipino or Indonesian martial art. I just thought this was an interesting and unique weapon and wanted to see what the products from TFW looked and felt like. I paid the regular $177 for this knife.
Initial impression: Very light and fast. With a POB right above the hilt, you can instantly tell that this knife is not about chopping or hacking. It has a very solid and well put together feel in spite of its lightness. In terms of looks, it’s not unlike a small Ginunting.
Stats:
Blade length- hilt to tip 11”, primary edge 10”, secondary edge 6” overall, with about 5 ½” of actual sharp edge. Thickness at the ricasso 0.235”, midpoint 0.161”, at the “mitsukado” 0.145” Width at ricasso 1.035”, width at “yokote” 0.910”
Steel- The TFW website does not seem to list steel type. It appears to be a carbon steel, as opposed to a stainless. Initial impression is that its decent to good steel, well heat-treated. I’d be happy for any help on this. I’ll shoot off an email and see if I can get an answer and update this.
Handle length- just over 5”
OA length- just under 16 ½”
Guard- width 0.945”, length 2.170”, thick 0.140”, protrudes 0.735” edge side, 0.325 spine
POB- about 0.850” from the hilt, or at the top of the ricasso, just below where the grind starts.
POP- not sure how I should measure this, but the “sweet spot” seems to be from about 6 ½” to 9 ½”, or around 8” up the blade.
Weight- I don’t have the right scale for this, so I can only guess +/- 1lb w/scabbard. Lighter than most knives this size, for sure.
Components(blade, handle, guard, pommel, scabbard)
Kinda hard to define this blade style. Double-edged reverse Lum tanto? Double-edged wharncliff/tanto type thing…? Anyway... It’s double ground (both sides of the blade are ground, as well as both edges) and seems slightly hollow ground (I had to check it with the edge of a credit card). If you look at the blade stats, you’ll see the blade has distal taper and gets narrower towards the tip. The secondary edge removes even more material, leaving a blade that feels extremely lively and agile. If I were more poetic, I’d make some clever analogy to a hummingbird or a dragonfly. I’m not, but you get the idea. Both edges were sharpened to a high degree, although both edges still had a significant burr. The secondary edge was slightly less sharp than the primary edge. I find both of these things to be fairly normal, and this does not constitute a critisism of the knife at all. The blade is finished to what looks to be about 400 grit, and the primary edge is very slightly concave/curved inward. Grind lines are crisp, clean, and symmetrical, at least insofar as there are no glaring errors or horribly sloppy spots. It’s not laser-perfect, but it’s more than acceptable for a knife at this price point. After all, it is Traditional Filipino Weapons, not CNCed Filipino Weapons. If I had to boil it down to a couple words, I’d say “wickedly beautiful” would be fairly appropriate.
The handle is, to me at least, an unconventional design. After a very short time, I got used to it, and I like this handle on a lot of levels. For one thing, I’m pretty sure this is Macassar Ebony, a wood I’ve worked with a lot on my lathe, and one of my favorite woods. Although it is of the same genera as the more well known Gabon or African ebony, it is not nearly as prone to checking and cracking. It also has some pleasing color variations, from straw colored to inky purple/black. Macassar ebony is only slightly less dense than Gabon ebony, and has a lot of natural oils that make the wood more resistant to moisture. The unusual shape of the handle makes for a very natural-pointing knife, and as I said before, it feels like a long, sharp, shiny index finger. Excellent retention qualities. Surprisingly, the handle feels quite natural in reverse grip, although I’m not sure if it was designed to be used in that manner. There is a sort of a spur on the back of the pommel that lands in a weird place on my palm. I’m not even really sure if it bothers me, but it may be something I decide to remove down the line.
The guard and “fuchi” (for lack of a better term) are steel, or at least iron, as they pass the magnet test. They are colored black, and although mine hade a slight rusty layer they easily cleaned up to a nice patina. These components, as well as the blade/handle connection overall, seem super solid and tight, with no evidence of shifting or movement whatsoever, even after a few bad cuts on water bottles that put a significant amount of stress on the knife.
One of the many great things about this knife is that the scabbard is not just an afterthought. I’m not sure what type of wood is used, but it is quite solid and fairly light. A steel piece is screwed to the back that serves as a belt loop/retention device. The retainer holds the knife very securely, but it also leaves a small scuff where it contacts the fuchi/guard. I took off the unit by removing two small screws, and the scabbard has an excellent friction fit with no rattle. It takes quite a bit of shaking before it wants to fall out of the scabbard when held upside down. Additionally, this knife just looks great in the scabbard, something I can’t say about too many knives. Great lines, and the light colored wood of the scabbard compliments the dark fitting and handle quite nicely. A couple finger grooves near the mouth of the scabbard, and the overall light weight and balance, make it comfortable to carry this knife sheathed in the hand, and it’s easy to tuck into a belt or sash.
Sharpness deserves its own category here. I only have a few knives that I can get and keep sharp enough to pass my ultimate sharpness test; cutting a single, free-hanging human hair (watch your fingers!). This is one of them. As I said, the knife arrived with a burr still on the edge. It did not take much work with 1200 grit on a mousepad and then a charged horsehide strop to get this thing ridiculously sharp. After cutting a few plastic bottles, pool noodle and slicing paper it was still popping hairs like crazy the whole length of the blade. The secondary edge was not quite as sharp. With very little work, however, it was scraping/shaving arm hair, and will take just a little more effort to get it properly sharp. Narrow-bladed double edged knives tend to suffer from poor edge geometry in terms of cutting. Happily, that is not the case with the Hagibis.
Handling: Amazingly fast, light and precise. The blade feels like a long index finger, as if you could instantly put it anywhere you wanted to. I’m not exaggerating when I say you could sign your name with this thing. It excels at snap cuts (the reverse tanto point bites extra deeply on snap cuts) and thrusts, and is capable of brutally effective slashes. The razor sharp secondary edge makes back cuts effective. I’d say this knife would/could be used for very fast pre-emptive attacks to the hand, arm and face, as well as any and all organs and arteries that are normal knife targets. I’d imagine that someone with some fencing training could make pretty good use of this knife, although maybe not in the manner intended. That’s the sort of feel it has to it though. Despite how it may look on a computer screen, it is definitely not a chopper.
Test cutting: Unfortunately I have no video camera. However, in the three days I’ve had this knife, I’ve cut some small/med water bottles, rope (about 1/3” course fiber), pool noodles, blackberries, cardboard, paper, etc. Although these are fairly light targets, the Hagibis exceled at all of them. Thick, woody blackberry stalks did require some extra effort; hardly surprising, as this is at the opposite end of the spectrum from a heavy bladed brush clearing knife. I’d say ½” bamboo would be too heavy a target for this weapon.
Conclusions: If you couldn’t tell already, I’m pretty pleased with my purchase. This knife has hardly been out of my hand since it arrived. I will definitely be getting more goodies from TFW, but until then, this might be my new favorite fighter! It has a mixture of classiness a scariness that I find particularly appealing. I have yet to push this knife very hard, but it’s done fine so far, and I don’t expect any nasty suprises. I managed to come up with a few cons below, but they are things that might bother some folks, not anything that disappointed me in any way.
Pros: -Very light, fast and agile (did I stress that?)
-Designed by an expert with much edged weapons combatives experience, not some mall ninja or armchair samurai. Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje appears to me to be the real deal.
-Edge geometry, heat treat and steel make this sucker SHARP. I’ve never owned a Shiva Ki or Phil Hartsfield (blades renowned for their supposed crazy sharpness), but I can’t imagine they have too much on the Hagibis.
-Exotic (but totally functional) looks, styling and materials
-Exceptional cost/quality ratio
Cons: -A touch of rust on the fittings.
-Unconventional grip design (from a Western standpoint) may not be everyone’s flavor
-Too light-bladed to be much of a chopper. That’s not what this knife is about, but if that’s what you’re looking for, well, TFW might have something else for you…
Bottom line: The Hagibis feels like a highly specialized predator. It may not suit everyone’s style; bowie or khukri guys will probably not like this one so much. On the other hand, I would speculate that someone skilled in the use of this weapon would eat a heavy-knife wielder for lunch. :twisted:
Questions, comments, and critisism welcome
I knew what was in the triangle shaped Priority mail box as soon as I saw it sticking out of my mailbox. Hagibis! My first purchase from www.traditionalfilipinoweapons.com ( TFW) was well packed, with a protective grease and plastic film on the blade itself, stored in the scabbard and then wrapped in several layers of bubble wrap. Additional padding was placed at the ends of the box. It arrived 3 business days after I ordered it, via USPS priority, which is included in their base shipping price, even though the website indicates first class. Cool!
I’m not new to the world of knives. At one point I owned over 200 knives, mostly production, brands like BRKT, Microtech, Dalton, Kershaw and CS and a smattering of Fallkniven, Protech, MOD, Dawson, etc. Eventually I narrowed that down to the current 50 or so, but I do have some definite opinions on what I should get for my dollar when it comes to knives. I do not, however, have any training or background in s.e. Asian martial arts, so I can only guess when it comes to how the designer of this weapon intended it to be used. For those that are interested, there appear to be quite a few videos available on Pikiti Tirsia Kali.
I’ve had the Hagibis for about three days now, enough time for the “new toy joy” to wear off a bit, and for me to do some cutting and sharpening. I guess not in that order.
Historical: From the TFW website:
“The Hagibis knife dates back to the Spanish occupation, but was re-designed by the grandfather of the now Grand Master (GrandTuhon) of Pekiti Tirsia Kali, Leo T. Gaje. It was Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje who made the Hagibis popular back the early 60's. The Hagibis was re-designed by him to make it a more effective "killing use only" blade! This blade was made for only one purpose...to kill. Any other tasks for this knife such as for utility use or for Philippine jungle survival is secondary. This knife can still perform today because it is hand forged to perfection and developed specifically for the modern day warrior. The Hagibis is a knife that has to be held in the hand to get the full appreciation for it…”
This system appears to have quite the reputation. From Wikipedia:
“Pekiti-Tirsia's movements are based on the traditional blade art of the Philippines - Kali, which involves slicing swords in a circular motion, symbolic of the orbits of the moon and the planets. It also incorporated triangular movements symbolic of constellations. In ancient times, Kali was taught in rituals that were then used pragmatically to survive against adversaries and wild animals.
Pekiti-Tirsia Kali specifically was a family system that goes back at least four generations, starting with Norberto Tortal. It was further developed and improved during the years 1930-36 by his grandson Conrado Tortal. Tortal was from Panay, the island that the chieftains from Borneo settled on when Kali came to the Philippines. The system is now headed by Leo Tortal Gaje Junior, the grandson of Conrado Tortal.
In the year 1997 the Centennial Celebration for 100 years of Pekiti-Tirsia was celebrated in Subic Bay, Zambales, Philippines last October 25, 1997. Pekiti-Tirsia was the only Filipino Martial Art officially recognized as having a centennial.
Pekiti-Tirsia is currently the only Kali system recognized by the Philippine government used to train Force-Recon Marine Battalions of the Armed Forces of the Philippines and the Special Action Force (SAF) contingent of the Philippine National Police.”
Pekiti-Tirsia Kali specifically was a family system that goes back at least four generations, starting with Norberto Tortal. It was further developed and improved during the years 1930-36 by his grandson Conrado Tortal. Tortal was from Panay, the island that the chieftains from Borneo settled on when Kali came to the Philippines. The system is now headed by Leo Tortal Gaje Junior, the grandson of Conrado Tortal.
In the year 1997 the Centennial Celebration for 100 years of Pekiti-Tirsia was celebrated in Subic Bay, Zambales, Philippines last October 25, 1997. Pekiti-Tirsia was the only Filipino Martial Art officially recognized as having a centennial.
Pekiti-Tirsia is currently the only Kali system recognized by the Philippine government used to train Force-Recon Marine Battalions of the Armed Forces of the Philippines and the Special Action Force (SAF) contingent of the Philippine National Police.”
Full disclosure: I have no affiliation with TFW, Pekiti Tirsia Kali, or any Filipino or Indonesian martial art. I just thought this was an interesting and unique weapon and wanted to see what the products from TFW looked and felt like. I paid the regular $177 for this knife.
Initial impression: Very light and fast. With a POB right above the hilt, you can instantly tell that this knife is not about chopping or hacking. It has a very solid and well put together feel in spite of its lightness. In terms of looks, it’s not unlike a small Ginunting.
Stats:
Blade length- hilt to tip 11”, primary edge 10”, secondary edge 6” overall, with about 5 ½” of actual sharp edge. Thickness at the ricasso 0.235”, midpoint 0.161”, at the “mitsukado” 0.145” Width at ricasso 1.035”, width at “yokote” 0.910”
Steel- The TFW website does not seem to list steel type. It appears to be a carbon steel, as opposed to a stainless. Initial impression is that its decent to good steel, well heat-treated. I’d be happy for any help on this. I’ll shoot off an email and see if I can get an answer and update this.
Handle length- just over 5”
OA length- just under 16 ½”
Guard- width 0.945”, length 2.170”, thick 0.140”, protrudes 0.735” edge side, 0.325 spine
POB- about 0.850” from the hilt, or at the top of the ricasso, just below where the grind starts.
POP- not sure how I should measure this, but the “sweet spot” seems to be from about 6 ½” to 9 ½”, or around 8” up the blade.
Weight- I don’t have the right scale for this, so I can only guess +/- 1lb w/scabbard. Lighter than most knives this size, for sure.
Components(blade, handle, guard, pommel, scabbard)
Kinda hard to define this blade style. Double-edged reverse Lum tanto? Double-edged wharncliff/tanto type thing…? Anyway... It’s double ground (both sides of the blade are ground, as well as both edges) and seems slightly hollow ground (I had to check it with the edge of a credit card). If you look at the blade stats, you’ll see the blade has distal taper and gets narrower towards the tip. The secondary edge removes even more material, leaving a blade that feels extremely lively and agile. If I were more poetic, I’d make some clever analogy to a hummingbird or a dragonfly. I’m not, but you get the idea. Both edges were sharpened to a high degree, although both edges still had a significant burr. The secondary edge was slightly less sharp than the primary edge. I find both of these things to be fairly normal, and this does not constitute a critisism of the knife at all. The blade is finished to what looks to be about 400 grit, and the primary edge is very slightly concave/curved inward. Grind lines are crisp, clean, and symmetrical, at least insofar as there are no glaring errors or horribly sloppy spots. It’s not laser-perfect, but it’s more than acceptable for a knife at this price point. After all, it is Traditional Filipino Weapons, not CNCed Filipino Weapons. If I had to boil it down to a couple words, I’d say “wickedly beautiful” would be fairly appropriate.
The handle is, to me at least, an unconventional design. After a very short time, I got used to it, and I like this handle on a lot of levels. For one thing, I’m pretty sure this is Macassar Ebony, a wood I’ve worked with a lot on my lathe, and one of my favorite woods. Although it is of the same genera as the more well known Gabon or African ebony, it is not nearly as prone to checking and cracking. It also has some pleasing color variations, from straw colored to inky purple/black. Macassar ebony is only slightly less dense than Gabon ebony, and has a lot of natural oils that make the wood more resistant to moisture. The unusual shape of the handle makes for a very natural-pointing knife, and as I said before, it feels like a long, sharp, shiny index finger. Excellent retention qualities. Surprisingly, the handle feels quite natural in reverse grip, although I’m not sure if it was designed to be used in that manner. There is a sort of a spur on the back of the pommel that lands in a weird place on my palm. I’m not even really sure if it bothers me, but it may be something I decide to remove down the line.
The guard and “fuchi” (for lack of a better term) are steel, or at least iron, as they pass the magnet test. They are colored black, and although mine hade a slight rusty layer they easily cleaned up to a nice patina. These components, as well as the blade/handle connection overall, seem super solid and tight, with no evidence of shifting or movement whatsoever, even after a few bad cuts on water bottles that put a significant amount of stress on the knife.
One of the many great things about this knife is that the scabbard is not just an afterthought. I’m not sure what type of wood is used, but it is quite solid and fairly light. A steel piece is screwed to the back that serves as a belt loop/retention device. The retainer holds the knife very securely, but it also leaves a small scuff where it contacts the fuchi/guard. I took off the unit by removing two small screws, and the scabbard has an excellent friction fit with no rattle. It takes quite a bit of shaking before it wants to fall out of the scabbard when held upside down. Additionally, this knife just looks great in the scabbard, something I can’t say about too many knives. Great lines, and the light colored wood of the scabbard compliments the dark fitting and handle quite nicely. A couple finger grooves near the mouth of the scabbard, and the overall light weight and balance, make it comfortable to carry this knife sheathed in the hand, and it’s easy to tuck into a belt or sash.
Sharpness deserves its own category here. I only have a few knives that I can get and keep sharp enough to pass my ultimate sharpness test; cutting a single, free-hanging human hair (watch your fingers!). This is one of them. As I said, the knife arrived with a burr still on the edge. It did not take much work with 1200 grit on a mousepad and then a charged horsehide strop to get this thing ridiculously sharp. After cutting a few plastic bottles, pool noodle and slicing paper it was still popping hairs like crazy the whole length of the blade. The secondary edge was not quite as sharp. With very little work, however, it was scraping/shaving arm hair, and will take just a little more effort to get it properly sharp. Narrow-bladed double edged knives tend to suffer from poor edge geometry in terms of cutting. Happily, that is not the case with the Hagibis.
Handling: Amazingly fast, light and precise. The blade feels like a long index finger, as if you could instantly put it anywhere you wanted to. I’m not exaggerating when I say you could sign your name with this thing. It excels at snap cuts (the reverse tanto point bites extra deeply on snap cuts) and thrusts, and is capable of brutally effective slashes. The razor sharp secondary edge makes back cuts effective. I’d say this knife would/could be used for very fast pre-emptive attacks to the hand, arm and face, as well as any and all organs and arteries that are normal knife targets. I’d imagine that someone with some fencing training could make pretty good use of this knife, although maybe not in the manner intended. That’s the sort of feel it has to it though. Despite how it may look on a computer screen, it is definitely not a chopper.
Test cutting: Unfortunately I have no video camera. However, in the three days I’ve had this knife, I’ve cut some small/med water bottles, rope (about 1/3” course fiber), pool noodles, blackberries, cardboard, paper, etc. Although these are fairly light targets, the Hagibis exceled at all of them. Thick, woody blackberry stalks did require some extra effort; hardly surprising, as this is at the opposite end of the spectrum from a heavy bladed brush clearing knife. I’d say ½” bamboo would be too heavy a target for this weapon.
Conclusions: If you couldn’t tell already, I’m pretty pleased with my purchase. This knife has hardly been out of my hand since it arrived. I will definitely be getting more goodies from TFW, but until then, this might be my new favorite fighter! It has a mixture of classiness a scariness that I find particularly appealing. I have yet to push this knife very hard, but it’s done fine so far, and I don’t expect any nasty suprises. I managed to come up with a few cons below, but they are things that might bother some folks, not anything that disappointed me in any way.
Pros: -Very light, fast and agile (did I stress that?)
-Designed by an expert with much edged weapons combatives experience, not some mall ninja or armchair samurai. Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje appears to me to be the real deal.
-Edge geometry, heat treat and steel make this sucker SHARP. I’ve never owned a Shiva Ki or Phil Hartsfield (blades renowned for their supposed crazy sharpness), but I can’t imagine they have too much on the Hagibis.
-Exotic (but totally functional) looks, styling and materials
-Exceptional cost/quality ratio
Cons: -A touch of rust on the fittings.
-Unconventional grip design (from a Western standpoint) may not be everyone’s flavor
-Too light-bladed to be much of a chopper. That’s not what this knife is about, but if that’s what you’re looking for, well, TFW might have something else for you…
Bottom line: The Hagibis feels like a highly specialized predator. It may not suit everyone’s style; bowie or khukri guys will probably not like this one so much. On the other hand, I would speculate that someone skilled in the use of this weapon would eat a heavy-knife wielder for lunch. :twisted:
Questions, comments, and critisism welcome