ghost
Member
Posts: 1,323
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Post by ghost on Jan 14, 2011 6:58:12 GMT
thanks frank. I got a very even coat and got it very very gray. I kept hot vinegar on it then when it got dark gray, I went ahead and rinsed with water, rubbed hard with windex, rinsed in water then repeated with the vinegar. I dunno if I was suppose4 to constantly keep heating the vinegar mixture in the microwave again and again to keep it hot...but I did.
it looks good so far but the nevrdull i'm using to polish has abrasives that are waay to fine, so I am not able to clear up the blade atm.
I think I'll have to go buy some mother's.
btw I can see the hamon already, huge (1 cm wide cept near the kissaki) and gorgeous.
Thanks again Crimsoned and Frank, I'll post a few pictures here soon as I can get some more of the gray patina-ish thingy off.
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Post by Crimsoned on Jan 14, 2011 22:20:27 GMT
Aye you do have to heat the vinegar up over/over again. Typically if you get it near boiling on the stove it will last 2 coats before it cools down too much.
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 17, 2011 21:18:18 GMT
so guys, any results we can see yet? very curious, thanks
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ghost
Member
Posts: 1,323
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Post by ghost on Jan 18, 2011 0:12:11 GMT
not quite done yet, frank. (since I don't have a good enough polish) Mother's should be coming in tomorrow and we'll see if the contrast gets even better. Right now it is visible, but there is light gray along the whole blade. Hopefully, I can get it to pop out. On a side note, I made 2 tsuka cores out of poplar for the KC -> one 1.5 in. shorter than the original and another 2 in. longer than the orig. edit: actually UPS shipped today so I got it. I'll get pics up if it goes down well. well...it went well..but the pics are another story late at night... Before Mother's : After: g I really don't know how you got it so dark on yours frank I think Crimson's and mine turned out similar. Mine is quite similar to the cloudy/ frosty Bamboo Mat / Lion Dog hamons
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Post by etiennehamel on Jan 18, 2011 3:28:51 GMT
because of the technique perhaps??? anyway it looks awesome to me i think i'll go for a kc for my next blade but i'm also playing with the idea of having my own huawei custom blade... too much choices, not enough money to fulfill my dreams...
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 18, 2011 17:55:56 GMT
AHHHHHHHHHH............there's that awesome hamon! looks great man. there are many factors involved in the different appearance including taking the pictures. how many baths did you give it? is there a lot of detail when you look closely?
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ghost
Member
Posts: 1,323
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Post by ghost on Jan 18, 2011 18:21:43 GMT
yea it does have a lot of activity! I was more partial to your darker hamon - at least that was what I was going for. I believe I neutralized the acid far to fast (panicky, everything feels like it is taking forever) likely around 40 secs and no more than 1 min. I did 6 baths -> Nevrdulled it/ alcohol -> another 8 baths. I also used 5% white vinegar instead of apple cider ;o
I may try it again with another cycle but 90-120 sec exposures and see if I can get your shade frank.
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 18, 2011 19:46:11 GMT
just keep in mind that we were using two different types of vinegar, and I don't use any metal polish in between baths, so this might be the difference in final tones. I use apple cider vinegar and clean in between (after windex to neutralize) with bon ami powder cleanser and rubbing alcohol.
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Post by Crimsoned on Jan 19, 2011 12:33:43 GMT
Mine came out darker then that, the whitish frosty etch only came out once when I put the katana downwards once. I stopped doing that.
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 19, 2011 15:36:59 GMT
pics moved to OP
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Post by SwordLord on Jan 19, 2011 18:18:12 GMT
Don't forget the oil quench KC uses can make the hamon vary from sword to sword. Some of my KC have zero wave like patterns like you see in Frank's pics and some do. Some have a lot of wootz banding and some have none.
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 19, 2011 18:37:16 GMT
I'm pretty sure they use water, though the hamon does vary from sword to sword quite a bit.
ok, here is a the FAQ from their site:
"Single edge swords or dagger are hardened on the edge only. The edge of the blade is heated red hot at about 1500 deg. F and quenched in water. This gives a hard edge of 60 RC (a file is 64 RC & most pocket knives are 55 RC). This tempered edge is called the ”hamon“ on the Japanese blades. The upper part of the blade is soft and has a hardness of 30-40 RC. The hamon is difficult to see and is rather faint but can be brought out by acid etch or some type of polishing. This process is one of the most difficult in Japanese sword style production. With the 5160 steel, about 20% ends up with a crack hamon. However, with the 1060 steel it is much more forgiving in the tempering process. Using oil for hardening/tempering is easier but the temperline is not as "nice". We only use water. "
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ghost
Member
Posts: 1,323
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Post by ghost on Jan 19, 2011 19:32:30 GMT
I have that very thin wave in the middle of the hamon very close to the edge and starts wiggling a bit towards the kissaki but it does not show up very well like Frank's. I polished it a bit more on the hamon and it has become a bit more subtle. I am very pleased. wish I could get my hands on a global gear titanium infused katana :x and inspect their hamon further. Thanks frank. ----here come the 6th or 8th karma I have given ya
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Post by frankthebunny on Jan 19, 2011 19:41:38 GMT
glad you like it, etching becomes addictive...........what doesn't around here! thanks for the K, I'm saving up to eventually trade for total consciousness, not all of us get the chance to caddy for the Dalai Lama like Bill Murray
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Post by SwordLord on Jan 19, 2011 21:11:05 GMT
I was told they were oil quenched, but that didn't come from KC. However, bottom line is that the effects vary from sword to sword, which makes it interesting each time I receive KC katana.
"Hi, I'm Dominic and I'm a KC addict."
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Post by katrulzin on Feb 11, 2021 20:07:11 GMT
I apologizing for reviving this ancient thread, but I figured this was better than creating a new one. I got my katana, but has a really bad saya rub scuff on one side, because my shipment looks like it was dropped one good time with a dent in the box with the tape ripped on one side. Other than that it looks very good and clean, but looks like it was used at least once since the edge looks slightly flat on one spot near the tip. Regardless it looks fine except the nasty scuff, so I guess I'm just gonna spend more money and polish it with some high grit sand paper (german), probably 2000 all the way up to 7000 and perhaps to 10000 depending on which grit gives me an appearance I like best.
Anyways I can get some 30% acidity white vinegar and was wondering if a higher % would have a better effect or outcome. I'll probably do my last cycle with lemon, but either way the hamon is pretty faded and the scuff is the number one visible thing. I wouldn't mind so much since it's gonna get scratches eventually, but the scuff is in a particular pattern that just really stands out and very shiny, that also runs right on the hamon in the very middle of the blade for a good 4-5 inches. Too bad the blade was knocked around and hit the saya pretty hard on one side. I might have to glue a little wood in the saya so it grabs the habaki better, I think it was knocked to where there's not much fiction to keep the blade in the saya and dented where the habaki rests. Plus the habaki has some scuffs too. So I got my work cut out for me.
Sorry, but thought context would be needed. Let me know if the 30% would make much difference verses 5% vinegar. And honestly I can get some industrial strength vinegar that is at 75%, but I think that might be a little overboard and most likely too damaging to the blade for how much corrosion it will likely cause if I don't neutralize it in time.
Edit: I don't know if Hanwei changed their Lion Dog model, but the sageo isn't the same of what you typically see, it's just a plain black sageo, pretty much the same kind that tied down the sword box.
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Post by viece on Feb 13, 2021 22:21:35 GMT
Interesting thread, thanks for bringing it out into the light again. I'm not into Asian weapons, but I've used white vinegar, lemon juice, and salt on various European blades. For instance: sbg-sword-forum.forums.net/thread/54033/another-vinegar-antique-oakeshott-xivPersonally, I like lower concentrations of vinegar because it gives you more time to check things and tweak. I've found that the higher concentrations make the steel go dead gray very quickly, overwhelming the interesting patterns that can form over a few hours with the lighter solutions.
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